Complaints

The complaint text that is displayed might not represent all complaints filed with BBB. Some consumers may elect to not publish the details of their complaints, some complaints may not meet BBB's standards for publication, or BBB may display a portion of complaints when a high volume is received for a particular business.

• Initial Complaint

  Date:12/30/2024

  Type:Order Issues
  Status:

  AnsweredMore info

  Complaint statuses

  Resolved:

  The complainant verified the issue was resolved to their satisfaction.

  Unresolved:

  The business responded to the dispute but failed to make a good faith effort to resolve it.

  Answered:

  The business addressed the issues within the complaint, but the consumer either a) did not accept the response, OR b) did not notify BBB as to their satisfaction.

  Unanswered:

  The business failed to respond to the dispute.

  Unpursuable:

  BBB is unable to locate the business.

  I hired *** from Systec Mechanical to install a natural gas line on my property and he sent 2 under qualified employees to do the job. These young guys had never done anything like it before and did such a poor job it barely passed inspection. I worry that there will be future leaks due to the errors performed by these apprentices.When I have tried to talk to *** about my concerns he disregards my complaints.He repeatedly tells me that since I accepted the quote, thinking that an experienced person would do the job, nothing else matters.I have paid two thousand dollars to Systec Mechanical and written several letters in an attempt to get some questions answered, but *** refuses to talk to me about my concerns. I have withheld $240.00 from the billed amount because I know it was unfair to charge me $85.00 per hour for inexperienced workers that messed up the job. There are several emailed letters to the owner, *** that I would like to send to you so that you have more information about my complaint and how I made a sincer effort to resolve my issues before I filed a complaint with you.Please instruct me how to send you this additional information.

  Business Response

  Date: 01/07/2025

  To all whom it may concern.  I find this complaint to be frivolous in nature.  I was asked to take a look at a gas piping (underground) job for Mrs. *********** She had the ditch dug, and had already purchased the pipe for the project.  In review of the materials procured, and after performing a proper gas load analysis, I informed Mrs. **** that the 3/4 inch pipe she had purchased was not of satisfactory size to service her house, shop and greenhouse some 100+ feet away.  I then advised that she return all undersized pipe for credit.  I then provided Mrs. **** a quote for the pipe, labor and city permit required for work.  Mrs. **** verbally accepted the quote, and went on to pay a 50% deposit required to initiate the work order.  Work was scheduled, competed, pressure checked, inspected by a city mechanical inspector.  the night following completion, Mrs. **** experienced a problem with her house furnace.  I sent an employee over who had to further bleed lines to get enough gas to her furnace.  There was of course no charge for this. 

  However, with job now done, Mrs. **** has debated everything from the crew sent over, our administrative fees, and overall cost.  My position is that we have followed every proper protocol for a satisfactory conclusion.  From job review, permitting, quote, acceptance, inspection, and warranty. I have responded to her many e-mails with factual information.  I have been in business since 1991 and this is the first occasion ever to elevate to this level.  We operate with customer in mind first as evidenced by the repeat customers we service.  Our business has grown exponentially every year, due to our commitment to quality.  

  Sincerely,

  *** **********

  Owner, Systech Mechanical

  Customer Answer

  Date: 01/10/2025

  From: Ker ****** <*************************> 
  Sent: Tuesday, January 7, 2025 9:57 AM
  To: Resolutions <**********************************************************************>
  Subject: Fwd: Difficulty in getting a hold of you
  
  You don't often get email from ***************** Learn why this is important 
  
  
  Sent from my iPad
  
  Begin forwarded message:
  From: Ker ****** <*************************>
  Date: December 30, 2024 at 3:41:05 PM PST
  To: "*** **************************" <***********************************************************>
  Subject: Re: Difficulty in getting a hold of you
  ***,  I am under the impression that you are refusing to answer my questions because I have asked you to on multiple occasions and you do not.  I have paid my account in full.  I dispute some of the labor charges as unfair.  I am sorry you have refused to talk with me about my dissatisfaction.  I will share my concerns with a higher authority. 
  Sincerely,  ***** ******
  Sent from my iPad
  
  On Dec 30, 2024, at 7:23 AM, *** ************************** <***********************************************************> wrote:
   
  Ker, the hourly rate is rather irrelevant in the context of a quoted bid.  That amount is considered only for the formulation of said quote.  I bear all risk associated with overages, material and labor warranty and system function.   
  My personal hourly is much higher.  Best solution is you pay agreed amount, we continue to serve with full heart and intent of good.
   
  Jim 
   
  From: Ker ****** <*************************> 
  Sent: Thursday, December 26, 2024 2:17 PM
  To: *** ************************** <***********************************************************>
  Subject: Re: Difficulty in getting a hold of you
   
  ***, You must not have not read my email from three weeks ago.  Please do so and then answer again.  I do deserve my questions to be addressed.  Then you will fully understand my dispute and can properly address it.
  Please take the time to go over my concerns and respond fairly.  My concerns have nothing to do with unfamiliarity with cost of trade work today.  I agreed to pay you eighty five dollars an hour, not your apprentices.  
  Sincerely, ***** ******
   
  On Fri, Dec 20, 2024 at 1:15 PM *** ************************** <***********************************************************> wrote:
  *****, we have followed all protocols to prevent this problem.  Site visit to correct bad ***** on the pipe sizing, a quote accepted, deposit delivered, work executed, inspections passed.  What else could I do?  Your unfamiliarity with cost of trade work today is not justification to not pay an agreed upon amount.  Please understand that I encourage that all quotes should be reviewed and evaluated, however once accepted, an odd time to critique the cost.
  
  -----Original Message-----
  From: Ker ****** <*************************> 
  Sent: Friday, December 20, 2024 8:57 AM
  To: *** ************************** <***********************************************************>
  Subject: Difficulty in getting a hold of you
  
  
  Dear  ***,
  I have stopped by your office to see you twice but you were out in the field.  I have called you and left messages for you to return my call, but have not heard back.
  Three weeks ago I spent considerable time writing you a long descriptive email about the ways I was unhappy with the work youre young employees did on my project.  After not getting a response from you  after two weeks I emailed it again.  In the email I encouraged you to give me a call so we could discuss the matter, but I have not gotten any response from you.
  I am certain that you are a very busy man, and I am sorry I feel the need to communicate with you about my dissatisfaction, but I feel it is your obligation to respond to me in a timely fashion.  I too am a very busy person, and your lack of a response has taken up additional time from me unnecessarily.
  KW Energy called to let me know that you would be installing my new heating and air conditioning system with the ***** money the city has secured.  I am in hopes that you will contact me to resolve my complaint on the recent gas line project before we move on to the new project.
  Thank you sincerely and I hope you and your family have a lovely Christmas holiday.
  ***** ******
  

  
  

  Customer Answer

  Date: 01/10/2025

  From: Ker ****** <*************************> 
  Sent: Tuesday, January 7, 2025 10:03 AM
  To: Resolutions <**********************************************************************>
  Subject: Claim#*********CA89
  
  You don't often get email from ***************** Learn why this is important 
  
  
  Sent from my iPad
  
  On Nov 27, 2024, at 10:22 AM, Ker ****** <*************************> wrote:
  ***, 
  Thanks for answering my email.  In your recent response to that correspondence you addressed customary charges and labor rates for your type of work.  That  was never the issue.  The issue was;  How can you charge $85 per hour X2 for 2 young men that have so little knowledge about the job they are tasked to complete?  How can you justify that rate for workers that have so little experience?  
  I dont dispute that highly experienced techs like yourself can charge $85 per hour, but it was not highly trained techs that worked on my job, but young men learning the trade.
  As for not being charged for **** returning, after hours, to my job site, he fully admitted his errors earlier that day and told me that, of course, there would be no charge.  He said he was not charging the company for that visit knowing that it was because of his lack of experience that created the situation that left me without heating and hot water.
  And the reason you had to make a second trip to my job, 1 mile from your office, was because I was complaining about the poor work that was done and my concerns about the problems it could cause.
  When you state that it would have been better to address my issues before you began the work, how could I have, when I had no idea there would be the problems that occurred?  
  My complaints were about the quality of the work performed by your employees.
  As I stated before, I believed that I was hiring you to come do the work, not far less experienced workers.
  Yes the job is completed now, but I still have concerns about the pressure on the fittings for the three branches of gas line.  ************ laid out too much pipe causing the line to bow up and not sit at the bottom of the 24 trench I dug.  When the pipe was forced to be pushed down into the trench, that created pressure on every transition along that 200 foot line. 
  You claim that perfection is your lowest standard, but clearly that is not true.
  Sincerely,  Care ******
  
  Sent from my iPad
  
  On Nov 21, 2024, at 2:46 PM, *** ************************** <***********************************************************> wrote:
   
  *****, thank you for the heartfelt message.  As far as the cost per hour goes, the time for  those rates has far been exceeded along with everything else in commerce.  I remember in 1988 technicians were at $65.00 per hour.   So in excess of 35 years later, the $20.00 in cost increases demonstrates our desire to keep costs down.  The loaded price of an employee with wages, benefits, vacation, worker compensation, insurance and overhead makes for very slim profit margins at best.   ******* did already deduct 2 hours of labor and due to the nature of a bid or quoted amount when **** had to come back after hours, you did not get charged.  That is the benefit of a quoted job, you have the backing of the company, we shoulder all risk of labor cost overrun, at no burden to end user.   In conclusion, we have acted in good faith,  I came over to review the pipe you had already purchased no charge, I load calculated for pipe sizing, no charge, made 2 extra visits myself and ****, again at no additional charge to you.  The job has been inspected, and approved, system running.  It sure would have been better to address cost concerns prior to work being done.  That said, we only want the best for our customers, you.  And in my heart believe we did that.
   
  *** Culverwell  
   
  From: info ************************** <*********************************************************> 
  Sent: Thursday, November 21, 2024 2:06 PM
  To: *** ************************** <***********************************************************>
  Subject: FW: Your Invoice from Systech Mechanical
   
   
   
  Best Regards, 
   
  *** ******
  Systech Mechanical LLC
  PO Box 45
  102 W ******
  Chewelah, WA 99109
  **************
  Fax: *************
  <image001.png>
   
  From: Ker ****** <*************************> 
  Sent: Thursday, November 21, 2024 10:07 AM
  To: info ************************** <*********************************************************>
  Subject: Re: Your Invoice from Systech Mechanical
   
  Dear *** and *******,
  I received your invoice today through my email for the natural gas line project.  I would appreciate it if you would be willing to consider some things that I have to say in regards to the work that you did for me.
  When I agreed to the estimate that you provided me with originally I was under the impression that *** was doing the work.  I thought that the labor charge was high but I felt that *** was worth it.  When two very young men showed up to do the job I watched them closely to make sure they seemed competent.  It became obvious to me that they were not fast or efficient and when I questioned **** if he had ever done a job like mine before, he said it was far more complex than anything he had ever done with underground gas lines.  As I observed them working on my project, I was disappointed in the quality of their work and at how slow they were at the task.
  I observed that **** did most of the work and called into the office to ask questions about what he should do.  DJ did little more than tape trace wire to the ** pipe once **** got it connected.  When they were nearly done I asked **** about the pipe bowing up nearly to the top of the ditch and he assured me all pipe would be laying on the bottom when they were done.  That was not the case though.  The ditch had been designed to be 24 inches deep and in several places it bowed up within 6 inches from the top of the ditch.  
  Because I was worried that the inspector would not approve the work, I called *** and asked him to come look at the job.  He did come and tried to force the pipe down into the bottom of the ditch without any luck.  He assured me that it would be okay and that the inspector would approve the job.  The next day I called the inspector and he told me he had seen the work and I could cover it up now.  I asked him if the pipe bowing up near the top of the ditch was a problem and he told me that he believed that it would likely get pushed down when the ditch was backfilled or as time went by.  I asked if it would put too much pressure on the many joints as it was forced down and he said that it would probably be alright.
  When I called ******* and told her that I had been mailed a final bill but the gas was not hooked up yet, she agreed to send someone out to complete the job.  I also pointed out that I had been billed for 8 hours but the guys had been there only 2 hours so far.
  When the 2 workers were here the first time they had forgotten essential parts and rather than have them go back to the shop, I went to the shop and picked up the parts for them.
  When a week later **** came to complete the job, he made some errors that caused me to be without hot water or heating for my home.  He had failed to bleed the line enough so that gas was reaching my appliances or to re-ignite my hot water heater.
  He admitted that he should have made sure that everything was working before he left.
  This leads me to the point of this letter.  I believe that is was completely unfair to charge $85 dollars per hour for inexperienced workers and I am asking you to adjust the labor part of your invoice to reflect a more realistic amount of $45 dollars per hour.
  I would not make this recommendation if the job had gone smoothly and I had been happy with the work.  But I honestly feel that it is both fair to you and to me to make this change in the billing.
  I would feel comfortable talking with you over the phone if you would like to discuss this further, otherwise, if you adjust the billing, I will pay it immediately.
  I hope to have you put in a new furnace for me next year so I am not wanting to make you feel badly with me, I just want things to be fair for both of us.
  Sincerely,
  ***** Care ******
  On Nov 20, 2024, at 12:17 PM, Systech Mechanical <***********************************************> wrote:
   
  Sent from my iPad
  Hello ***** ******,
  
  Please find your invoice from Systech Mechanical attached below.
  
  If you have any questions regarding this invoice or would like to book future services, please give our office a call at **************.
  
  For your convenience, you can now make a payment by clicking the link below.
  
  Thank you for choosing Systech Mechanical. 
  
  Pay Balance Here! 
  
  Sincerely,
  Your Friends at Systech Mechanical  
  <Invoice #********.pdf>
  

  
  

  Customer Answer

  Date: 01/15/2025

  > Dear ***,
  > I am more than sorry that you were unwilling to address my complaint on the project your employees worked on at my house some weeks ago.  I spent considerable time addressing the issues and made it very clear about why I was dissatisfied with the work, but you refused to answer my concerns.  I felt certain I deserved that after paying you two thousand dollars on a job I am unhappy with.
  > I have asked the Better Business Bureau to help with resolution on this matter since I feel like you avoid addressing it.  All of this has taken a lot of time, and like you, I am very busy and wish you had been willing to just talk to me over the phone so that we could have just taken care of this matter weeks ago.
  > I am in hopes that the bbb will be helpful with my dispute so that we can end this matter and both move on.
  > Sincerely,  ***** ******

  Customer Answer

  Date: 01/21/2025

  
  
  Dear BBB,
  I am responding today to *** *********** correspondence from Jan. 7th, 2025.
  I have carefully read *** *********** response to my complaint filed Dec.29, 2024.
  Mr. ********** states that he quoted me charges for the city permit required for the job, but in fact he did not.  As you can see, on several occasions I requested that information but it was not provided to me until I requested it, after the fact, from **** ***** at the City of Chewelah.  Systec simply ignored my requests even though I had a right to know how much the permit cost.  I believe ****** did not provide the requested information because they charged me $454.00 for the $105.00 permit.  I dispute the $300 overcharge for that permit and would like that money refunded to me.
  Mr. *********** gave me the direct impression that it would be he that did the work on my project.  Therefore I was concerned when two 19 year old boys showed up unsupervised on the job site and seeming confused about how to proceed.  I asked *****, one of the workers if he had ever done anything like this before and he told me he had not, but thought he could figure it out.  I was very concerned that these two inexperienced guys had been sent out on my job without even initial supervision.
  *****, being the lead worker and BJ the assistant, who did very little but stand around, made several calls to *******, the office manager, to ask how to proceed.
  When the gas line was laid down into the 24 ditch, too much line was installed and after the fittings were installed it bowed up out of the ditch.  Because the workers had forgotten to bring all the materials they would need they told me they were going to return to the shop to obtain them.  When I pointed out that I was paying the two of them $***** per hour, or $170.00 per hour for the two, and didnt appreciate the extra time involved, they told me that they were only getting a fraction of that charge themselves.
  I opted to go to the Systec shop myself to get the forgotten part to save myself the additional money.  As it turned out, I had to go twice because of them forgetting the gas fitting that would allow them to pressure test the line when it was completed.
  When the installation was all hooked up it bowed up nearly to the top of the ditch in places due to the installation of too much pipe length.  Because I had personally installed a water line beneath the gas line I realized what had gone wrong.  ***** assured me that they would remedy that problem, but they never did.  I asked them when they were leaving why they had not taken care of that problem and they said they did not know how.  I called *** *********** and told him of the problem and he assured me he would come over and take care of it.  But when he came over and I pointed out why I was unhappy with the work, he began jumping on the gas line trying to force it down into the ditch without success.  I pointed out that the gas line would not meet code and *** assured me that **** ***** would pass anything he asked him to.
  Still concerned, I then called **** ***** with the city building ***** and told him about the problem.  He said that he thought that the line would be forced, at least somewhat, down into the ditch when it was backfilled.  I stated that would put a lot of pressure on the line and fittings.  And though he agreed, he told me he thought ****** would come back and fix the situation if the line leaked.  He agreed with me that it certainly was not an ideal situation, but that he would approve the job at any rate.
  I realized at this point that I was being forced to accept a substandard job and would need to be on the alert for future complications.
  Mr. *********** mentions that I had a problem with my furnace later and that he sent ***** back to fix it at no charge.
  But it was ***** that caused the problem with both my gas furnace and gas water heater by not bleeding the air out of the new gas line or re lighting the appliances.  The day of the installation I came home in the evening to a house that was only 51 degrees and no hot water.  When I called *** at Systec he said they would come the next day to remedy the problem and I insisted he send someone out that night.  He sent out ***** to do that and ***** admitted to me that he had not done his job in making certain that the appliances were working before he left.  Because he had come without the proper tools he needed, I loaned him tools from my garage and helped him complete that task.
  Please take a moment to look at the website of Systec mechanical and see how *** claims that perfection is our lowest standard in giant print across the top of the website.  I believe I had a right to expect at least a decent job, if not perfect, especially since a gas line can be a dangerous thing.  I could have installed it myself better!
  Mr *********** employees performed a shoddy job and yet he insists that this is all water under the bridge.  I have written him, called him and stopped by to discuss this issue with him and he had avoided me and refused to discuss my concerns.  That is the reason I have involved the Better Business Bureau.
  I am unhappy with the poor job done on my project and frustrated at the effort it has taken to get Mr. ***************** attention.  His unwillingness to discuss my concerns is unfair and his desire to push past the problem is not acceptable.
  In my first correspondence with Mr. *********** I told him I disputed his charging ***** per hour for inexperienced employees and offered to pay ***** per hour, even though that seemed like a lot.  He refused to accept that or to discuss it further.  He felt there was no room for negotiation with me.  I have paid two thousand dollars (and I provided most of the materials) and have withheld $240.00 only for the labor over charge.  Now that the city building ***** has provided proof that the permit cost only $105.00, I request a refund of $300.00 on the $454.00 that I was charged for the permit.
  I feel certain that Systec Mechanical is in violation of proper business practices.
  I am sorry to have felt the need to involve the BBB, but as is apparent, the owner of Systec Mechanical is being unfair to take advantage of me and likely other customers.
  Perhaps this will help him to think twice.
  Sincerely,  ***** ******
  

  
  

  Business Response

  Date: 01/24/2025

  It is my wish to put an end to this nonsense.  So lets stick with just facts.

  1.  Miss ****** contacted us to install gas piping purchased by herself.

  2.  Gas piping was of incorrect size for the intended purpose.

  3.  We assisted via phone calls to distributor to assist in getting the incorrect pipe returned.

  4.  We conducted the proper load calculations and sized all pipe and fittings.

  5.  A written quote was submitted with requirement for downpayment to initiate work

  6.  Verbal approval and downpayment received.

  7   Work was scheduled and completed

  8.  Work was inspected and approved for cover.

  9.  Miss ***** got PVC from us to go under driveway to protect pipe.  No Charge

  10.  No Heat Warranty.  No Charge, Same day service.

  11.  2 hour billing deduct, from 8 to 6.

  12.  Miss ***** still owes $240 unpaid.

  If there is an error in procedure in any of the above steps, I will gladly concede to Miss ******** and her objections.  I do not wish to keep up this pony show any longer unless some fact emerges of significance. 

  If no procedural error has occurred, then this is nothing more than a "customer" not wanting to pay obligatory billing.  Miss ****** needs to conduct business with those who share similar business philosophy. 

  All FACTS!

  *** **********

  Owner

  Customer Answer

  Date: 01/29/2025

   
  Complaint: 22748557
  
  I am rejecting this response because:Mr ********** has been evasive in regards to my dissatisfaction with the job his inexperienced employees did on my job site.  He has refused to even address my concerns and has instead commented only about what he considers the important points.  
  The reason I filed a complaint with the BBB and spent considerable time explaining my position was because I was in hopes it would help Mr. **********  and I to negotiate a positive outcome.  While I know the BBB cannot force a business owner to do that, it was withineason to expect my questions and concerns to be addressed.  I see at this point that Mr. ********** is not willing to cooperate and is only willing to look at things from his own side.  He has now resorted to mean spirited insults by calling my complaint to BBB a frivolous pony show and then accusing me of simply just trying to not pay my bill.  Surely I would not of paid two thousand dollars if not paying the bill was my motive.  Only $240.00 has been withheld and for good reason, as I have fully explained.  I have made an honest effort to explain my complaint without unkind or unfair comments.  I am now asking you to make a determination since you have considerable information from both sides and I believe more comments from Mr. ********** will only bring about more mean spirited comments.  Thanks to the BBB for trying to help negotiate a happy ending.           Sincerely,  ***** ******

   

  
  
  Sincerely,
  
  ***** ******

  Business Response

  Date: 02/04/2025

  To whom it may concern:

  In regard to the permit fee, it is a line item on both the Estimate and the Invoice.  This fee is a bundle of Administrative Costs as well as permitting, not just the cost of the permit.  Both attachments, the estimate and invoice for Miss ****** show the same amount and as a bundle item.  This bundle includes multiple site visits, phone calls to suppliers for procurement and to assist with Miss ******** returns, piping design and load calculation based on distance and BTU inputs, creating the estimate and revising the estimate, tracking down correct parts and supplies, filing, scheduling, etc. as well as the cost of the permit.  It is an important reminder that had Miss ****** stayed the course with her initial contractor and piping parts, nothing would have been up to code nor performed correctly due to inadequately sized pipe and fittings.  The supplier in which she purchased these from would not even accept her returns. They only accepted them after we contacted them and using our reputation, did they allow her to return them.  Again, this was articulated and accepted on the initial quote, none of which changed on the invoice.

  Customer Answer

  Date: 02/09/2025

   
  Complaint: 22748557
  
  I am rejecting this response because:  Mr. ********** is misleading you with the statements he is making about my complaints.  I repeatedly requested the invoice from the city of ******** showing the cost of the permit but ****** never end complied with my request.  I finally resorted to asking the city of ******** for that invoice which they gladly provided.  The cost of the permit was $105.  Mr ********** claims the $454.00 admin. Fee was a bundled charge.  He claims that the charge was for multiple site visits but that statement is untrue.  Mr ********** came initially to provide me with with a free estimate for which there was to be no charge.  He would have come only that once but when I called him to complain what unsuitable work was performed by his inexperienced workers he stopped by to look at the site and try to remedy the problems, which he failed to do.  Mr. ********** never made phone calls in my interest in regards to returning the few parts I was easily able to return.  He is misleading you when he states that.  I did provide the majority of the materials for the job.  There was no envision on the original estimate.  There was also never an original contractor as I had planned to the job myself, and I sincerely wish I had.  Mr ********** is also making a false statement when he says my supplier would not accept my return of the few pieces which they gladly and promptly did.

  In all honesty I wanted Mr ********** to respond to my initial complaint about sending extremely young inexperienced employees to my job site unsupervised to perform a job they were clearly unable to accomplish in a satisfactory way and then creating a big mess because they did not know what they were doing.  Mr ********** has avoided commenting on that subject entirely and that was the primary reason I filed this complaint.  At this point I have no faith that Mr ********** will respond to this claim truthfully or directly even with your intervention, I am sad to say.

   

  
  Sincerely,
  
  ***** ******