Complaints

This profile includes complaints for Above & Beyond Pools and Spas's headquarters and its corporate-owned locations. To view all corporate locations, see Find Local Branches.

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  Above & Beyond Pools and Spas

  380 Townline Road East Carleton Place, ON K7C 3S3

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  Above & Beyond Pools and Spas

  7317 Highway 29 Carleton Place, ON K7C 3P1

The complaint text that is displayed might not represent all complaints filed with BBB. Some consumers may elect to not publish the details of their complaints, some complaints may not meet BBB's standards for publication, or BBB may display a portion of complaints when a high volume is received for a particular business.

• Initial Complaint

  Date:15/09/2025

  Type:Billing Issues
  Status:

  AnsweredMore info

  Complaint statuses

  Resolved:

  The complainant verified the issue was resolved to their satisfaction.

  Unresolved:

  The business responded to the dispute but failed to make a good faith effort to resolve it.

  Answered:

  The business addressed the issues within the complaint, but the consumer either a) did not accept the response, OR b) did not notify BBB as to their satisfaction.

  Unanswered:

  The business failed to respond to the dispute.

  Unpursuable:

  BBB is unable to locate the business.

  This complaint is against AB&B Pools for unlawful retention of my financial information. I did not provide consent for my credit card to be stored at any time. Despite this, AB&B admitted in a voicemail that they still had an expired card on file, even after confirming in writing that no card was kept. This constitutes storage without consent and against my explicit written instructions to delete all card information. I have also repeatedly requested proof of PCI DSS compliance, which is mandatory for any business handling payment cards, but these requests have been ignored. Their refusal to demonstrate compliance raises serious concerns that cardholder data is being processed in violation of required security standards.Under Canadas PIPEDA, organizations must obtain meaningful consent before collecting or retaining personal information, limit use to what is necessary, and destroy the information when no longer needed. AB&B has ignored these requirements, retaining my financial data unlawfully and against my instructions.This also violates BBB Standards of Trust, which require businesses to safeguard privacy, be responsive, honor promises, and embody integrity. AB&B has instead disregarded consumer rights, failed to respond in good faith, and mishandled sensitive data.I am requesting that the BBB investigate AB&B Pools for illegal card storage, refusal to comply with PCI DSS, and violation of PIPEDA, and that their BBB rating and accreditation be downgraded or revoked if compliance cannot be demonstrated.

  Business Response

  Date: 10/10/2025

  We appreciate the opportunity to respond to this complaint and clarify the facts.

  
  Above and Beyond Pools and Spas (Note not the correct name she used) takes customer privacy and data protection seriously. At no point was any financial information used unlawfully or retained in violation of applicable standards. The credit card referenced by the complainant was expired and inactive, and no charges were ever processed without authorization. Our systems do not store active card data without consent, and we have protocols in place to ensure compliance with PCI DSS standards. We have attached proof of this, which she has been given but "forgot" to add to her complaint. 

  
  The complainant was informed via email over a year ago that no card was retained on file. In fact, she herself posted this email publicly in a ****** review and here, clearly showing our confirmation that no financial data was stored. Her current claims directly contradict this documented communication.

  
  It is also important to note that this customer has multiple outstanding invoices for work that was completed in good faith. Despite repeated requests for payment, she has refused to settle these balances. Her refusal to pay for services rendered, combined with repeated false accusations and hostile communication, has led us to formally request that she seek services from another provider. It is our view that this complaint is a deliberate attempt to deflect from her unpaid obligations and discredit our business in retaliation for being held accountable. We would also like to note if we had a credit card on file why would we have not ran the card for her lack of paying her bills? 

  
  Our team made multiple respectful attempts to resolve the matter, but the dialogue became untenable due to abusive and bullying behavior. Her ****** review was removed by ****** for violating platform policies.
  We remain committed to upholding BBB Standards of Trust and Canadian privacy laws. We respectfully request that this matter be considered closed, as no unlawful activity occurred and the complainants concerns have been addressed to the extent possible.
  

  
  

  Customer Answer

  Date: 10/10/2025

  Complaint: 23887351
  
  I am rejecting this response because: it contains multiple false and misleading statements and does not address the central issue of my complaint, which is the unlawful retention of my financial information.

  The company claims that proof of *** DSS compliance was provided, but no legitimate documentation has ever been received. The emails I attached clearly show that I continued to ask for this proof and never received anything. The only confirmation I ever received was verbal assurance that all credit card data had been deleted, which was later proven false when the office manager admitted they still had an expired card on file.

  It is contradictory for the company to state that no card was stored while simultaneously acknowledging that they retained an expired card. An expired card still contains personal financial data and can be used for unauthorized activity. Retaining that information without consent for nearly two years is unlawful under PIPEDA.

  The document they have presented in response to this complaint as a *** DSS compliance certificate is not a valid Attestation of Compliance. It contains no validation date, assessor name, or version of the *** DSS standard, and appears to be a generic auto-generated notice rather than an authenticated certification. This further demonstrates their lack of transparency and the misleading nature of their statements.

  Their suggestion that this complaint was made in retaliation for unpaid invoices is untrue. There is one disputed invoice only, and it was during our attempt to resolve that discrepancy that we discovered they had retained my card information. We were verbally quoted $150 for a repair that was later invoiced at almost $600. Part of the inflated cost was for additional labour to remove a stone to access the faulty part. However, this was a direct result of their own construction error, as they had been instructed the prior year not to glue down that specific stone so that access would be possible for this type of maintenance. The repair itself involved a component from a manufacturer they insisted we use, which failed after only one year.

  We offered to pay the quoted $150 plus tax, but they refused to adjust the bill and told us not to contact them again. There are no other unpaid invoices, and their statements to the contrary are false.

  They repeatedly have quoted that their phone calls are recorded, which, should they wish to provide, would substantiate our claims that we remained calm and reasonable in offering to settle the matter, and that it was their office manager who became abusive and bullying during those conversations.

  Their response to the BBB continues to ignore the substance of this complaint. The issue is not the cost of service but the mishandling of private financial information, contradictory and misleading communication, refusal to provide required compliance documentation, and attempts to charge us for their own installation error.

  Their response provides no legitimate evidence of *** DSS compliance and fails to account for the nearly two years they retained my credit card information without consent.

  For these reasons, I do not accept their response and request that this complaint remain open and on record.
  
  Sincerely,
  *** ******

  Customer Answer

  Date: 10/10/2025

  It is also untrue that my ****** review was removed; it remains published and visible to the public (see attached time/date stamped screenshot). Additionally, the name used in their BBB response does not match the official business name shown on their own ****** profile, which again demonstrates their lack of consistency and attention to accuracy in their public communications.

  Business Response

  Date: 15/10/2025

  We appreciate the opportunity to respond to the concerns raised.

  **************** takes data privacy, regulatory compliance, and transparency seriously. We would like to clarify the following points:

  PCI DSS Compliance Documentation:
  We have provided the complainant with the documentation we are legally obligated to share under Canadian law. This includes confirmation of our PCI DSS compliance status.
  The complainants request for additional internal documentation, such as assessor details, validation dates, or full Attestation of Compliance, is not required to be disclosed to external parties and may contain sensitive operational or security-related information.
  Sharing such details could compromise our internal privacy protocols and security posture, which we are bound to protect under both PCI DSS standards and our own data governance policies.

  ******************************************* are designed to comply with PCI DSS and PIPEDA requirements regarding the handling and retention of payment card data.
  The expired card referenced was retained in a non-transactional, non-accessible format and was not used for any processing or storage purposes. It was not active in our systems and posed no risk of unauthorized activity.
  While we acknowledge that the expired card was still visible in a legacy record, this does not constitute unlawful retention under PIPEDA, as no personal financial data was actively stored, processed, or used without consent.
  We have acted in accordance with our legal obligations under PIPEDA and PCI DSS. We are not required to disclose internal compliance documentation beyond what is necessary to confirm our adherence to standards.
  The document provided was a valid summary of our compliance status. While it may not resemble a formal Attestation of Compliance, it reflects our current standing and was generated from our compliance management system.
  We reject the characterization of our statements as misleading. We have communicated in good faith and provided all required information within the bounds of privacy law and industry standards.

  We remain committed to protecting customer data and complying with all applicable regulations. However, we must also safeguard our internal security documentation and privacy protocols, which are not subject to public disclosure.

  We must also address a serious concern: the complainant has made repeated requests that, if fulfilled, would require our company to violate Canadian privacy laws and PCI DSS standards. We will not, and legally cannot, comply with demands that compromise our regulatory obligations or the privacy of other individuals and systems.

  It is worth noting that the complainants public complaint was removed from ******, which may reflect the platforms own assessment of its validity or appropriateness.

  We are issuing a formal warning: any further attempts to coerce our company into unlawful actions, or continued misuse of complaint channels to harass or defame our business, will result in escalation. This may include reporting the behavior to appropriate legal or regulatory authorities.

  Rather than continuing to make unfounded accusations and attempting to damage a business you chose not to pay, we strongly encourage the complainant to educate themselves on the actual requirements and boundaries of PCI DSS and PIPEDA. These frameworks are designed to protect all parties,including consumers, and we remain committed to upholding them.

  We will not tolerate baseless claims, unlawful demands, or defamatory behavior.We have fulfilled our obligations under Canadian law and industry standards,and we expect the same level of respect and accountability from those who engage with our business.

  Clarifying the Nature of This Complaint:
  Despite the complainants insistence otherwise, the core issue appears to stem from unpaid invoices and a refusal to accept responsibility for charges incurred. The complainant continues to reference billing disputes while simultaneously attempting to reframe the matter as a data privacy violation. This pattern of shifting narratives undermines the credibility of the complaint.

  If I were the BBB, I would question whether this platform is being used appropriately in this case.The complainant is not engaging in a constructive or informed dialogue, but rather using the BBB as a tool to pressure a business into waiving legitimate charges and disclosing sensitive internal documentation that we are neither obligated nor permitted to share.

  The complainant has repeatedly made inaccurate claims about PCI DSS and PIPEDA requirements, and has demonstrated a fundamental misunderstanding of how compliance frameworks operate. We strongly encourage the BBB to consider the technical and legal context here: this is not a case of mishandling data, but of a customer refusing to accept professional boundaries and legal limitations.

  As the Controller of this organization, not an office manager as the complainant incorrectly stated, I hold formal credentials and have invested substantial time,education, and financial resources into understanding and implementing compliance protocols. I am fully aware of our obligations under Canadian law and international standards, and I stand behind the accuracy and integrity of our responses.

  We urge the complainant to cease these attempts to misrepresent facts, intimidate staff,and misuse consumer protection platforms. We have fulfilled our obligations. 

  The complainant has referenced our recorded phone lines and suggested that these recordings would support her version of events. We maintain call recordings for quality assurance and internal documentation purposes, not for public distribution or dispute resolution. We are under no obligation, legal or procedural, to provide these recordings externally, and doing so would violate our internal privacy policies and potentially expose other parties information.
  We categorically reject the claim that any member of our team, including myself as the Controller, behaved in an abusive or bullying manner. This accusation is both false and defamatory. I am not an office manager as the complainant inaccurately stated, I am the Controller of this organization, with formal training and substantial financial and compliance expertise. I am well-versed in the legal and operational standards that govern our business, and I stand by the professionalism of our communications.

  The complainant continues to misstate the amounts owed. The correct charges are:
  $150 for the replacement part
  $189.99 for the technicians service call
  These charges were clearly communicated, discussed with the technician, and are consistent with our standard billing practices. The complainant has used our services in the past and is fully aware that technician visits are billable. Her claim that the total is $600 is simply incorrect and reflects either a misunderstanding or an intentional misrepresentation.

  This ongoing attempt to avoid payment by shifting the narrative toward unrelated compliance accusations is not only unproductive, it is misleading. We find it a waste of time to entertain requests for call recordings or rehash conversations that do not change the fact: the complainant owes this amount and has refused to pay.

  In closing, we urge the BBB to recognize the pattern here: a customer who refuses to accept no as an answer,who misrepresents facts, and who attempts to weaponize consumer platforms to avoid financial responsibility. This is not a matter of transparency or compliance,it is a matter of unpaid bills and refusal to engage constructively.
  We have fulfilled our legal obligations, communicated clearly, and acted professionally. We will not continue to entertain baseless accusations or unlawful demands.

  
  

  Customer Answer

  Date: 15/10/2025

  Complaint: 23887351
  
  I am rejecting this response because it continues to include factual inaccuracies, deflection, and an alarming level of hostility that demonstrates the very behaviour I originally described.

  The company continues to misrepresent what was provided and what is legally required. Their statements regarding PCI DSS documentation are internally inconsistent. They claim both that they have already provided proof of compliance and that they cannot provide it because doing so would violate privacy laws. Both cannot be true. It is also false that they previously provided me with any such documentation. The deficient document they produced as part of their response to thie complaint was shared for the first time only after this complaint was filed. If they have documentation proving compliance, it can be shared in a redacted form, as it is specifically designed for that purpose. PCI DSS standards do not restrict a business from providing an Attestation of Compliance confirming their validation status. The claim that disclosure would violate privacy laws is false and misleading. The Attestation of Compliance exists precisely so a merchant can demonstrate adherence to PCI DSS without exposing internal or sensitive details. The document they provided includes none of the required elements: no validation date, assessor identification, PCI DSS version, or signatures. It is a generic system-generated message, not a valid Attestation of Compliance.

  Their assertion that the expired card they retained "posed no risk" and was "non-transactional" is equally flawed. The company's claim that an expired card in a "legacy system" poses no risk misunderstands PIPEDA requirements. PIPEDA Principle 4.7 requires that personal information be protected by security safeguards appropriate to the sensitivity of the information. The fact that they acknowledge retaining this data in a "legacy record" suggests it was stored in an outdated system that may not meet current security standards. Furthermore, the "expired" status is irrelevant. The card was active when it was stored without my consent, and it remained in their system for nearly two years after I explicitly requested all card information be deleted. Retaining any portion of cardholder data, including card numbers or expiry information, in a legacy system is still subject to PIPEDA. The fact that the card was active when stored, and that their representative later confirmed its existence after it expired, directly contradicts their claim that all card data had been deleted.

  To clarify the timeline, which can easily be substantiated by the recorded calls they claim to have: My husband contacted the company once or twice regarding questions about the current invoice and did not receive a return call. A couple of weeks later, they called and left a voicemail in which their representative stated they had my expired credit card on file. This was the first I had heard my card was still being retained, and it was shocking because I had previously been assured in writing that all card information had been deleted. I returned the call specifically to address the credit card retention issue, letting her know that my husband would handle the billing discussion separately and providing his contact information. The privacy violation was discovered through their own voluntary disclosure in that voicemail, not fabricated as retaliation for a billing dispute. I called back specifically to discuss the unlawful card retention that I had repeatedly been assured a year earlier had been deleted. The BBB exists specifically for situations where a business refuses to address a consumer's concerns transparently.

  The company's tone and language are further cause for concern. Their repeated threats of "formal warnings," "escalation," and "reporting to authorities" because I filed a consumer complaint are unprofessional and intimidating. Attempting to characterize a consumer's legitimate privacy inquiry as "harassment" or "coercion" is inappropriate.

  Regarding their continued attempt to minimize this issue as a "billing dispute," the facts remain unchanged. I am attaching Invoice #**** dated August 21, 2025, which the company now claims represents "multiple separate charges." As shown, this is a single invoice totalling $597.76. The Work Details section clearly documents that labor charges included removing stones to gain access, work necessitated by their own previous installation error when they glued down stones despite being instructed not to do so for exactly this reason. We were verbally quoted $150 for this repair, which we accepted. The company's own technician told us that the stones were glued down and had to be removed using a heat gun, a direct result of their previous installation error, which they now seek to charge for correcting.

  This invoice also directly contradicts their claim in their initial response that we have "multiple outstanding invoices." As the attached invoice clearly shows, there is one disputed invoice. Their attempt to misrepresent our account standing is defamatory and further demonstrates their pattern of providing inaccurate information to deflect from the legitimate privacy concerns raised in this complaint.

  I am also including a new timestamped screenshot showing my ****** review remains active. In fact, the company's public response to my ****** review contains several significant inconsistencies with their BBB statements. In their ****** response, they acknowledge that *** "reviewed the recorded conversations" and made decisions based on them. They also state in their ****** response that "*** has previously communicated with you regarding outstanding balances" (plural). However, *** has never contacted me. When I previously requested a callback from ***, I was told that *** doesn't have anything to do with the business. Yet their ****** response claims he has communicated with me multiple times and reviewed our recorded calls. Additionally, as the attached invoice proves, there is only one disputed invoice, not multiple outstanding balances as they claim. Their ****** response also admits "the referenced card was expired (from 2023) and not the active card on file," which directly confirms that card data was retained despite their repeated denials. These contradictory statements across different platforms further demonstrate the inconsistency and lack of transparency that characterizes their responses throughout this complaint process.

  I have made no unlawful demands and have not requested any document that would violate privacy laws. I requested proof of compliance with PCI DSS, an explanation for the retention of my credit card data without consent, and a corrected invoice reflecting the quoted amount. It is also worth noting that I have not asked for the release of recorded calls, only that, since they claim to have them and there is a discrepancy between our accounts, those recordings would serve to clear up the discrepancies.

  This response again avoids accountability and attempts to discredit a consumer for asking legitimate questions about billing and data handling. The aggressive tone, misrepresentation of legal requirements, and refusal to provide transparent documentation further demonstrate that this business has not met its obligations under PIPEDA or PCI DSS.

  The company's conduct throughout this complaint process, including documented inconsistencies, attempts to misrepresent facts (multiple outstanding invoices when only one exists, claiming my ****** review was removed when it remains published, providing a deficient compliance document while claiming they cannot share such documentation due to privacy laws), threats and intimidation tactics toward a consumer exercising legitimate rights, and refusal to address the core privacy violation, further substantiates my original request for the BBB to review and adjust their rating accordingly. A business that responds to consumer complaints with hostility, misrepresentation, and legal threats rather than transparency and good-faith resolution does not embody the BBB Standards of Trust.

  For these reasons, I continue to reject their response and request that this complaint remain active and on record

  Sincerely,
  *** ******

• Initial Complaint

  Date:10/08/2023

  Type:Sales and Advertising Issues
  Status:

  AnsweredMore info

  Complaint statuses

  Resolved:

  The complainant verified the issue was resolved to their satisfaction.

  Unresolved:

  The business responded to the dispute but failed to make a good faith effort to resolve it.

  Answered:

  The business addressed the issues within the complaint, but the consumer either a) did not accept the response, OR b) did not notify BBB as to their satisfaction.

  Unanswered:

  The business failed to respond to the dispute.

  Unpursuable:

  BBB is unable to locate the business.

  We purchased a service on June 2, the installation of a new pool. During the process there were many discrepancies from what the seller promised to provide. Once the product arrived they installed with many delays, inappropriate conduct and products that were not what we had ordered and in the end they said they couldn't provide what they said. When we disclosed our displeasure they then added substantial additional charges that weren't even discussed or warranted or agreed upon. We have conversations and photos of all of the work throughout and their Service Manager has out right lied about what was said. We are disputing the extra charges and them not being able to provide what we had agreed upon. We want to pay for what we believe is the correct amount and taking into consideration the incorrect items they provided and the items they could not provide. Now it has cause a great deal of stress and time spent on issues that were avoidable.

  Business Response

  Date: 11/08/2023

  Thank you for contacting us and allowing us to clarify our position.
  The clients hired our company to both purchase and install a 27'Above Ground Pool.  One of the procedures that must be completed before installing an Above Ground Pool, is the base.  It cannot be bedrock and it cannot be grass.  The client advised that they fully understood the construction and importance of the base.  They advised that they would take care of this portion of the installation.  Therefore, the original contract did not include the establishment of the base.  It is worth noting that an Above Ground Pool that is improperly established will not stand,nor will it last any length of time.  When our technicians arrived, the area was scraped down to bedrock but nothing else was done. The area was quite swampy and there were large holes due to the removal of trees/tree stumps. as well. The extra costs the client refers to is the material required to establish a proper base as well as the establishment of the base.  We would not build an Above Ground Pool without this base. All contracts given to our clients routinely have costs for base materials and construction.  The clients removed this portion.  When our tech did his pre-check to determine the status of the base the client was providing, he found it wanting.  The client was informed that more work was necessary. He advised our tech and our owner via phone, to go ahead and do whatever was necessary to properly establish the base.  This construction was done before the pool items arrived so that we could proceed with installation immediately upon the pool items arrival.
  Due to supply chain issues, which were due to labor strikes, the pool installation was scheduled 10 days after our four-to-six-week promise.  We received the items and within twelve hours,went out to the clients home to install. Our contract indicates that we are not responsible for supply chain issues, the client was advised of this when the contract was presented, and the client signed this contract. The liner pattern the client ordered was not the pattern we received with the other items we ordered for their pool. It was sent to us in error by our supplier. The client agreed to take the pattern we received at a considerable discount.  The liner, while the wrong pattern, was and is perfectly suitable and working.  The pool was installed and the clients are enjoying the pool today.
  The clients were discounted, in good faith, for items they refused upon delivery.  A new contract was not signed with either the discounts or the extra work.  This is often the case as time is of the essence in pool installations.  We have a very short installation season and wish to complete all jobs as soon as possible to take advantage of the best weather for installations.  The client did not enter into the contract until June 2nd, 2023, which means that we know we can't get the installation done before the middle of July.  Often, by the middle of August, the weather is not longer suitable for installations.
  We are sorry that the clients have found the process stressful.  This is unavoidable when beginning a construction process.  Summer is by far the most important and busiest time of the year for us. We have staff that are stretched to their limits for four months of the year, which is why we encourage clients to contract and plan on building a pool in their yard before the summer season begins.  
  As to the reference that our service manager lied, we have no evidence of this and have been transparent throughout the process. Evidence of inappropriate conduct would be appreciated.
  At this time, the client has a beautiful, well established Above Ground Pool.  It is usable.  To date, the client has refused to pay any funds on the remaining balance despite having their pool. The clients are disputing $2250.00 for extra groundwork to prep the area for a proper base. The clients owe more than $9000.00. The client has the product and has not paid for it. The clients advised they would pay $4000.00 towards their invoice on August 9th, 2023, yet we have not seen any payments from this client.
  Above and Beyond is a small business that relies on its accounts receivable being paid to keep the business running.  Above and Beyond expects payment for product delivered and work completed. Currently, the clients have the product, have the completed service, and are enjoying their pool. Above and Beyond offers and has offered financing options should the clients be unable to pay off the remaining balance.

  Customer Answer

  Date: 21/08/2023

   
  Complaint: 20452042
  
  I am rejecting this response because:
  Hello,
  
  
   In response to Above and Beyond's email, we would like to outline the areas that are incorrect.
  1) In regards to the installation of the base required for the pool. At no time did we say that we were going to "take care" of the base's construction. With *****'s over 20 years of experience in heavy construction, he is well aware of the importance of foundation and base preparation. Which is why we specifically sought out and hired a company to perform this very important task. We did begin preparing the area that we wanted the pool to be constructed by removing the organic materials as well as two tree stumps that the installation ******* identified as potentially being an issue down the road. Although the ******* did say that they would and could remove the stumps, it would have been at an additional cost. So, with the install already being behind schedule, we decided that we would remove the stumps as well as fill in the excavation left by the removal of the stumps.
  Apon the arrival of the installation crew, the ******* believed that the area for the pool needed further excavation, to bedrock if possible, (despite Above and Beyond stating in their previous email that bedrock is not desirable) and removed more material.
  
  
  2) At no time before, during the process of ordering, waiting for our order to arrive or, during construction had either one of us spoken to the owner or had the owner even attempted to contact us either by phone, text or, email. Stating that we had told both the owner and tech "to go ahead an do whatever was necessary to properly establish the base" is completely false.
  
  
  3)The discount for the liner was applied after WE contacted Above and Beyond about the wrong liner being delivered to site, without so much as a phone call or email to advise us of this issue. It was only after we were informed that the liner that we had selected was not and, would not be available that we accepted Above and Beyond's offer of a discounted price for the liner that was delivered. The items that were refused upon delivery were refused because they were either something other that what was quoted in our original contract or something that had not yet been supplied. 
  
  
  These are just three of the outline issues from this most recent response from them. As there has been multiple attempts on our part to have an honest discussion about expectations and come to a respectful and amicable outcome, we are requesting an intervention of mediation or legal representation as every discussion with Above and Beyond Pools either, in person, by phone, or email is full of discrepancies of what they have said from one time to the other and full of inaccurate comments and accusations with lack of any accountability. It is not just the fact or attempt at hiding invoice altercations after the fact without communication or agreement but it is the companies conduct on many levels that we are complaining about and not as much emphasis on their dishonest timeframe given. That was the least of the concerns at this point. 
  
  
  Please advise how we can get a third party involved other than email accounts as we would like to come to a reasonable and fair solution for both parties. 
  
  
  Thank you for your assistance.
  
  
  
  Sincerely,
  
  ***************************

  Business Response

  Date: 23/08/2023

  Thank you for your response.
  Above and Beyond Pools and Spas is at a loss as to the position the clients are taking on this matter.
  The clients claim to understand the installation process, yet the clients requested that the preparation for the site be removed from the quote as they would take care of it themselves.  Otherwise, the preparation for the site would have remained on the original quote and invoice.  The ground was not prepared, as the clients have here admitted.  The clients gave permission for the base to be established and therefore, Above and Beyond Pools and Spas prepared the base and are seeking payment for the supplies and material to do this.
  Above and Beyond Pools and Spas does not understand how the clients continue to maintain that they have not communicated with the owner.  The owner, and the installation crew spoke with the clients. We must speak to the clients to move forward with a project. As to the complaint that they had not spoken to anyone during the wait time, our Office Manager has emails and date stamped voicemails that refute this.  The clients were updated every time the clients reached out.
  Discounts were given to the clients by Above and Beyond Pools and Spas for items not taken, and the incorrect liner pattern being delivered.  Again, the liner arrived in store late afternoon the day before installation. The Office Manager noticed the error.  The Office Manager could not reach the supplier until the next morning at 9:00AM, at which time,the Office Manager called the supplier to get the information required to notify the clients of their options.   The clients were immediately offered a discount for the incorrect pattern, as supplied to Above and Beyond Pools and Spas in error.  The option to wait for the proper pattern was offered and rejected via email by the clients.
  Above and Beyond Pools and Spas has attempted to contact the clients several times, via telephone, text messages and email, to speak of these issues. The owner drove out to their home at 3:00PM on August 17, 2023, to speak with the clients, as per one of the clients requests.  The clients were informed of this visit time ahead of time via text message with the owner.  It is notable, that we do have another text message from one of the clients that they are not to speak or communicate with Above and Beyond Pools and Spas again, by the other client. The clients have refused all contact, and instead, have chosen to air their issues with the BBB.  Above and Beyond Pools and Spas believes it to be true that the clients are attempting, through the BBB, to avoid payment.
  Above and Beyond Pools and Spas, again,requests all evidence of improper or unprofessional behaviour, by their staff.  Broad accusations do not address the issue and leave Above and Beyond Pools and Spas with no possible recourse.
  It is the position of Above and Beyond Pools and Spas that the clients are now stealing, as they have a beautiful pool on site that is operable and usable.  The clients refuse to pay the goods and services, they have received and are enjoying.
  
  

  Customer Answer

  Date: 08/09/2023

   
  Complaint: 20452042
  
  I am rejecting this response because: Hello, We are responding to Above and Beyond's email disputing our concerns, and we would like to outline the areas that are incorrect. 1) In regards to the installation of the base required for the pool. At no time did we say that we were going to "take care" of the base's construction. With *****'s over 20 years of experience in heavy construction, he is well aware of the importance of foundation and base preparation. Which is why we specifically sought out and hired a company to perform this very important task. We did begin preparing the area that we wanted the pool to be constructed by removing the organic materials as well as two tree stumps that the installation ******* identified as potentially being an issue down the road. Although the ******* did say that they would and could remove the stumps, it would have been at an additional cost. So, with the install already being behind schedule, we decided that we would remove the stumps as well as fill in the excavation left by the removal of the stumps. Apon the arrival of the installation crew, the ******* believed that the area for the pool needed further excavation, to bedrock if possible, (despite Above and Beyond stating in their previous email that bedrock is not desirable) and removed more material. 2) At no time before, during the process of ordering, waiting for our order to arrive or, during construction had either one of us spoken to the owner or had the owner even attempted to contact us either by phone, text or, email. Stating that we had told both the owner and tech "to go ahead an do whatever was necessary to properly establish the base" is completely false. 3)The discount for the liner was applied after WE contacted Above and Beyond about the wrong liner being delivered to site, without so much as a phone call or email to advise us of this issue. It was only after we were informed that the liner that we had selected was not and, would not be available that we accepted Above and Beyond's offer of a discounted price for the liner that was delivered. The items that were refused upon delivery were refused because they were either something other that what was quoted in our original contract or something that had not yet been supplied. These are just three of the outline issues from this most recent response from them. As there has been multiple attempts on our part to have an honest discussion about expectations and come to a respectful and amicable outcome, we are requesting an intervention of mediation or legal representation as every discussion with Above and Beyond Pools either, in person, by phone, or email is full of discrepancies of what they have said from one time to the other and full of inaccurate comments and accusations with lack of any accountability. It is not just the fact or attempt at hiding invoice altercations after the fact without communication or agreement but it is the companies conduct on many levels that we are complaining about and not as much emphasis on their dishonest timeframe given. That was the least of the concerns at this point. Please advise how we can get a third party involved other than email accounts as we would like to come to a reasonable and fair solution for both parties. Thank you for your assistance.
  
  Sincerely,
  
  ***************************

• Initial Complaint

  Date:27/07/2023

  Type:Product Issues
  Status:

  AnsweredMore info

  Complaint statuses

  Resolved:

  The complainant verified the issue was resolved to their satisfaction.

  Unresolved:

  The business responded to the dispute but failed to make a good faith effort to resolve it.

  Answered:

  The business addressed the issues within the complaint, but the consumer either a) did not accept the response, OR b) did not notify BBB as to their satisfaction.

  Unanswered:

  The business failed to respond to the dispute.

  Unpursuable:

  BBB is unable to locate the business.

  Hello
  
  Our complaint appears to be similar to others on the *** website.
  
  This company sold us a product that they could not deliver and is refusing to return our deposit and/ or provide the service.
  
  I have provided the last email we have sent to the company for reference below.
  
  In short it appears this company continues to fraudulently take consumers money as a deposit promising products and services they cannot supply.
  
  We would like our money returned promptly as they cannot provide the service, there has been ongoing excuses ( similar to other complaints ) they have offer another liner however this is not what we want nor what we agreed to therefore it is more than fair to return or deposit additionally they have not been able to book an appointment with us regardless further supporting they are unable to deliver the service and product also warrant for return of our deposit.
  They cannot continue to take peoples money and not give the consumer what was agreed upon this is fraud. And it appears there is a pattern.
  
  Regarding : Ordered liner April 2023
  
  Attention : Above and Beyond pools and spa
  
  
  Good Afternoon,
  
  We as you are aware ordered a liner to be replaced in our pool April 2023.
  
  We were told it would be installed may/june 2023
  
  Upon inquiring we were told it was moved to July 2023, additionally if we took our services else were our deposit would not be refunded.
  
  We are now at the end of July 2023 with out our pool liner this no pool and no communication as to when it will be delivered and installed.
  
  If a date to install is not provided out deposit is to be refunded immediately. It is fraudulent to not return the funds as you could. It delivery the product we selected and made an agreement on. We are aware that you have suggested selecting another option this is not what we want nor is it what we agreed too.
  
  Therefore we respectfully request an installation date and if this cannot be accommodated please let us know when we can pick up our deposit due to services not being able to provide including the product of service.
  
  Thank you
  **** *** ******* *******

  Business Response

  Date: 28/07/2023

  We have been working with you to provide you with the service you were requiring. You have paid a deposit and delay of this party choosing a liner and choosing a liner that isn't a limited selection. 

  This email was sent April 18, 2023 at 1:42pm - To ****

  "Would you be able to pick, in order of preference, two other
  liners as the Hudson is noted as being “Limited Quantity”.  We will do all
  we can to supply you with the Hudson, however, if the supplier has sold out
  their limited quantity,  we will need alternative liner preferences."

  We provided you other options which we take responsibility that you were provided with the wrong liner choices from an employee who has been with the company for 4 months and still learning, to which she sent an email saying the following (minutes after the email sent in error) 

   Jun 26, 2023, at 16:58, *********************** wrote:
  
  Hi **** *** *******,
  
  You are going to think I am unwell. I had sent you the
  incorrect link. Not knowing choices for above ground and in ground liners are
  different.
  My greatest apologies, it has been very busy. I never
  thought there was to be a difference. **** (name)*** has sent me the correct link.
  Please see below.
  
  Regards,
  

  *****(name) ********

  To which you emailed back June 26, 2023 6:35pm (an hour and a half later after the store is closed) 

  "We
  will pass on this last set of samples      If you can’t get
  either of are previous selections.  Please refund are money and we will try
  and get somebody else to do it.  We were told mid May early june and here
  we are July.  We left are regular pool place to give your business a
  chance and so far I’m very disappointed." 

  The last communication that the office emailed you was on June 27th with the following email

  "Hi ****,
  
  I tried to call you
  two times today to discuss.
  
  Please give me a
  call.
  
  Regards,
  
  ***********(name)********
  Above & Beyond Pools and Spas
  380 Townline Road East
  Carleton Place, ON
  K7C 3S3***** ************
  ******* ************
  

  We provided you multiply selections from a different supplier to get you a liner sooner, as our supplier was communicating the samples you choose could not be manufactured in a timely manner (delays could be up to 2 months). You portray that this is of fault of Above and Beyond. This is not an excuses, rather reality. We do not manufacture liners here we sell them. This is out of our control and we worked with you, as we were in communication on regular bases as you can see the few emails in this response. You knew that your choices were limited. As we are updated from our supplier about the delays, we communicated with you right away. We started the next step to get you a liner from another supplier in order to get the contract completed. 

  You have not called the office back to discuss. We are looking to speak to you directly. I have also attempted calling you July 5th.2023 and July 11th, 2023. It is hard to provide you with any form of solution when you do not answer your phone or even come into the store. How would the company provide you any form of return of deposit if we have no information to do so? This is why we ask you to call the office. 

  I would also like to remind you that the "screenshot" that you attached to your complaint was missing the legal contract that you are in with Above and Beyond (deposit you made and applied too)
  It clearly states the following: 

  . 
  The customer agrees, binds and obligates himself to pay contractor for the work above for the sum of the whole contract. Any increase, decrease in the contract price, change in the work or change in the contract must be set forth in a change order signed by both parties. Payment shall be made to Above and Beyond based on the agreed upon and stated payment schedule in this contract and should be paid in full immediately upon completion of the project. Completion shall be that date when the work is completed sufficiently to enable the customer to occupy or utilize the work in the manner in which it was intended to be utilized.
  Payment can be made by cash, bank draft, credit card or e-transfer. Bank drafts to be made payable to ***** ****** **** E-transfers to ***********. Any payments made by credit card will be subject to a 2% credit card merchant fee.
  Project may be delayed due to weather, fire, material shortages, acts of God, state of emergencies, customer delays or other normal variations in the construction process including, but not limited to, the selection, ordering, manufacture and/or installation of customer selections. Failure of the contractor to timely complete the project shall not be considered default of this contract and deposits will be non-refundable. 

  Your contract clearly says deposits are non refundable. We have been asking you to contact the office to discuss this moving forward to which you have not and simply email demanding a deposit back with no information. 

  This is not fraudulent action. You have a contract you are in with the company. You are not calling or coming in to discuss. Demanding money via email with no way for the company to know where to apply it.

  We recommend you call the office to discuss matters further. *** doesn't get your info to return your "non-refundable" deposit. We agree this has been going on to long, there is no solution to be had until you call the office. 

   

  Customer Answer

  Date: 28/07/2023

  
  
  Complaint: 20385334
  
  
  
  I am rejecting this response because: as noted in other complaints the company is not truth we have called and left messages without a return call the voice machine also indicated to email or come into the store we emailed as we are currently unable to come in as we have two critical ill children we are attending too. 
  The company has a ongoing problem of taking peoples deposits and not providing the service discussed or agreed to kindly return our deposit as you have not provided the product or service nor does it seem apparent that they plan to do.
  writing a  bunch of words with no merit or value does not allow this company to hind  behind and continue to fraud people and not provide the product or service and just keep the persons money Please return our funds promptly. 

  
  
  
  Sincerely,
  
  
  
  ****** *** ******* *******

  Business Response

  Date: 28/07/2023

  We have explained our policy several times to you 

  Please contact the office between 9-5 Monday to Friday 

   

   

  Customer Answer

  Date: 31/07/2023

  
  
  Complaint: 20385334
  
  
  
  I am rejecting this response because:

  We cannot be any more clear 

  perhaps this will be helpful 

  if I go to a car dealer and make a contact / estimate for a F150 and put a deposit down and then the dealer says ya sorry we can’t get that truck so you have to take this 4 door car and the person says no I ordered the truck and the company says well we can’t get that so take the car and by the way if you don’t we are keeping your deposit ! That’s not ok or legal 

  another example If I purchase a home sign a contract place my deposit and then the realtor says sorry I can’t sell you that home you need to take this trailer instead as an option and ya no deposit is being returned again that is not ok 

  again not legal or right etc

  another example if I make a contract with a photographer leave a deposit then I cancel for what ever reason well guess what here is where the deposit is lost and remains with the company 

  your company on the other hand is like the two first examples a deal was made for the first two choices of pool liner 

  you have not or cannot get those liners 

  Your end of the sale is not fulfilled you have not given what you promised and offered therefore if you cannot provide the product and service you must return the deposit quite honestly it’s not hard to understand. 
  

  additionally if you are continuing to sell produces you don’t have and can’t get them keeping the consumers money this is not only unethical it is fraud. 
  

  It is quite clear you are refusing to provide the product and service we will take legal next steps as for this method of seeking resolution we can only hope it will prevent anyone else from being ripped off. 
  

  In conclusion, we are again respectfully requesting the contract be fulfilled or return our deposit. 

   

   

  
  
  
  Sincerely,**** *** ******* 
  
  ****** *******