ComplaintsforClinton Street Theatre

• Initial Complaint

  12/04/2023

  Complaint Type:

  Order Issues

  Status:

  Answered

  More info

  I booked the Clinton Street Theater early in 2023 for 2 hours on December 2nd for a film premiere. I paid $600 per our email agreement. 2 weeks ago I was told I need to pay an additional %10 despite this never being discussed during booking or having this fee transparently detailed. I was able to convince Clinton Street Theater to not charge me and additional %10 on ticket sales -- their claim was they were doing me a favor only due to my screening being a charity event for Ourside In (a local ******** non profit that provides aide and housing to homeless youth. I was notified the night of the screening that I would not be provided a list of ticket sales but rather would need to trust the Clinton to count, tabulate and pay out my door for the night. It is December 4th and I still do not have the money I worked to earn for a ******** charity. Clinton Street Theater staff insist I must send them my bank acount informstoon to be paid. I am uncomfortable doing since I have yet to verify the accuracy of my door count with names attached to the number and due to their blanket lack of transparent since booking this even earlier this year.

  Business response

  12/05/2023

  This customer did not indicate that he he wanted the theater to sell tickets "on a sliding scale basis" on his behalf until less than 10 days before his scheduled rental, which was offered at a reduced rate of $600 as opposed to our regular full price of $800. As our sales system does not accommodate sliding scale tickets and incurs fees for every transaction, which we noted we would usually charge a 10% fee to cover. We waived that fee. He was also offered the ability to sell his own tickets. He declined.
  
  His claims of donation to charity are suspect as in his communications to others he indicated he would only be donating the amount that exceed his cost of renting the theater plus film production, which he indicates (see screenshot) are over $1,000. As his screening only sold 31 tickets at $8 for a total of $248, there is no reason to believe he is donating any potion to charity. Furthermore, as a customer renting the ********************, he is no position to demand the private names and contact information of customers.
  
  Finally, the customer was offered to be sent recouped ticket payments via ACH or check by mail, a standard practice. He refused both, saying he was now out of the country, and expected the business to pay via a third party app that our bank does not connect to. In order to resolve this issue, we issued a $248 refund to the credit card he paid for the rental (see screenshot). The customer was informed of this via email before he submitted his fraudulent claim with the bureau.

  Business response

  12/05/2023

  This customer did not indicate that he he wanted the theater to sell  tickets "on a sliding scale basis" on his behalf until less than 10 days before his scheduled rental, which was offered at a reduced rate of  $600 as opposed to our regular full price of $800. As our sales system does not accommodate sliding scale tickets and incurs fees for every transaction, which we noted we would usually charge a 10% fee to cover. We waived that fee. He was also offered the ability to sell his own tickets. He declined.
  
  His claims of donation to charity are suspect as in his communications to others he indicated he would only be donating the amount that exceed his cost of renting the theater plus film production, which he indicates (see screenshot) are over $1,000. As his screening only sold 31 tickets at $8 for a total of $248, there is no reason to believe he is donating any potion to charity. Furthermore, as a customer renting the ********************, he is no position to demand the private names and contact information of customers.
  
  Finally, the customer was offered to be sent recouped ticket payments via ACH or check by mail, a standard practice. He refused both, saying he was now
  out of the country, and expected the business to pay via a third party app that our bank does not connect to. In order to resolve this issue, we issued a $248 refund to the credit card he paid for the rental (see screenshot). The customer was informed of this via email before he submitted his fraudulent claim with the bureau.

  Customer response

  12/06/2023

   
  Complaint: 20957492
  
  I am rejecting this response because:

  This business has lied several times in their messages on several points:

  1. This customer did not indicate that he he wanted the theater to sell  tickets "on a sliding scale basis" on his behalf until less than 10 days before his scheduled rental, which was offered at a reduced rate of  $600 as opposed to our regular full price of $800.

  This is false. In an email dated Fri, Mar 17, 2023 at 7:13?AM I specifically requested sliding scale tickets. This email and the theater's response is attached. In addition the price mentioned (and paid) in the March email was $600 and not $800. The term "$800 full price" here is surprising here. This is the first time I have heard them use this price -- also the invoice I pad was for $600 so I am unsure if they are asking I pay $200 more now after the event finished? Perhpas they could explain this confusing price structure so other customers can benefit.

  2. As our sales system does not accommodate sliding scale tickets and incurs fees for every transaction, which we noted we would usually charge a 10% fee to cover. We waived that fee. He was also offered the ability to sell his own tickets. He declined.

  The very first mention of the 10% fee to me was on Nov 26, 2023 a week before the event and after I had already paid them $600.
  
  3. His claims of donation to charity are suspect as in his communications to others he indicated he would only be donating the amount that exceed his cost of renting the theater plus film production, which he indicates (see screenshot) are over $1,000. As his screening only sold 31 tickets at $8 for a total of $248, there is no reason to believe he is donating any potion to charity. Furthermore, as a customer renting the ********************, he is no position to demand the private names and contact information of customers.

  I have several attendees to the event notify me that they gave cash over the $8 ticket price. None of that cash was given to me personally aside from a $20 bill from a staff member who assured me while handing it overt that he "wanted to make sure I got everything donated, here's a $20." Given my personal head count and conversations with attendees that night (all of which I know personally) I find it incredibly curious that Clinton Street is claiming I am the one stealing from a charity. Regardless of this: a list of names would provide a proper paper trail that proves who is the real criminal here. It's a little concerning they are unwilling to provide that information and expect one to trust their word without evidence given their frequent lack of being upfront and honest in their communication.

  3. Finally, the customer was offered to be sent recouped ticket payments via ACH or check by mail, a standard practice. He refused both, saying he was now
  out of the country, and expected the business to pay via a third party app that our bank does not connect to. In order to resolve this issue, we issued a $248 refund to the credit card he paid for the rental (see screenshot). The customer was informed of this via email before he submitted his fraudulent claim with the bureau.

  I have been booking and screening films for 22 years, much of them events that raise funds for charity. In all that time I receive an attendee list and the door cash out the night of the event, usually midway through the screening or at the end. Frequently it is cash but sometimes I am paid out via electronic transfer through a trusted process like Venmo/Paypal/Etc. I have never and will never give a business who has a tenuous grasp at truth at best, my bank account info details. When I offered the most wildly used bank to bank transfer service Zelle I was given an email to request the funds. Then, after they had given me a Zelle email and I sent the request I was told that "their bank" does not "do Zelle." It's unclear why they changed their mind after the request to be reimbursed was submitted through Zelle (it is still un-paid) since that is when I opened this case with BBB.

  Sincerely,
  
  *************************

  Customer response

  12/06/2023

  Email exchange regarding sliding scale tickets sent 8 months before the event.

  Customer response

  12/11/2023

  Complaint: 20957492
  
  I am rejecting this response because:

  As I have dutifully proven with my submitted evidence there is no truth to any of the statements made by this 'business.' As a recap I have reliably shown that I:

  - Made a request for sliding scale tickets in early 2023.

  - Am fluxed by their continued and bizarre demand that I pay them an additional $200 over the $600 I have already paid to rent the theater per our agreement in early 2023. This demand has been made after the event already occurred on Dec 2. Given this context I consider it a threat, or 'corrupt shake down' if you will. I reject their demand to pay it under any circumstances. For the record: the time that I and my audience occupied their theater was less than 2 hours time and our agreement was for a full 2 hours.

  - As of Dec 12, 2023 a full 10 days after the screening, I have not recieved the claimed 'refund' of $248 and in addition the theater still has refused to show a legtimate paper trail of how money was collected at the door. Akin to their their repeated hypocritical statements I consider their submitted proof of this 'refund' to likely be fraudulent. They did not allow me to use my own POS system the night of the event in person to collect donations on behalf of Outside In. The denial was likely an attempt to extort as much money as possible during the event for their own enrichment.

  - Discussions with attendees to the event has made clear to me that cash donations to Outside In were also not included in their claimed $248 take at the door. While they claim I somehow held my event for the purpose of stealing money from a local charity, I believe the onus again remains with them to prove how exactly I was able to steal money which I am not even in possession of. Unfortunately since they have a fragile grasp at truth at beast I would like to assume for the moment they may not be knowledgeable enough to read and comprehend the previous sentence. So let me spell it out for them: if I was going to steal money from a charity wouldn't I have to have this money? Like, in my wallet or bank account? Turns out I do not. That would suggest I am not the one running a front to steal charitable donations and these statements are pure projection. The 'business' can inform me if this explanation is still unclear and I will provide a drawing with arrows and words to hopefully make it clearer for them. :-)

  As of today I assume all money paid by attendees to the theater for the event on Dec 2 to be pocketed by theater staff and to be gone. Rather than waste any more of my valuable time acknowledging or giving credence to their repeated gaslighting, I have taken the initiative to make an _additional_ donation of $848 to Outside In. This was done on December 9th, 2023 at 3:24pm. The additional donation was made on top of the $600 'rental fee' and the 'claimed' $248 door take which this 'business' has taken for their own enrichment. The donation was made by an actual working staff member of my actual legitimate business, Sampo Films LLC. The Dec 9 donation was made in honor to _their_ "hard working staff" and they will also receive a personalized letter from Outside In noting their generous support!

  I hope this letter from Outside In serves as a reminder to them that the unfortunate and oppressed in ******** are appreciative of actions and not the words of idle boondoggling fronts masquerading as legitimate functioning businesses in our city. No need to thank us we are just happy to pass on what those in need deserve. :-)

  Cheers,

  n

  ----

  Thank you for your generous donation!

  From

  Outside In <*************************>

  To

  ********************;********************>

  Date

  Saturday, December 9th, 2023 at 3:24 PM

  Dear *******,

  Thank you for your gift of $848.00! To achieve our mission, we depend on the generous support of people like you. We are grateful for your kindness and hope you take great pride in the important difference your gift makes.

  You have made this gift in honor of Stolen Donations by Your Staff. A letter of acknowledgement will be sent on your behalf to It's sad what this once Great theater has become :-) at the following address: **** SE Clinton Street, ******** ** 97202.
  
  Your gift details:
  Amount: $848.00
  Payment Method: PayPal
  Date: 12/9/2023
  Designation: Basic Needs for Homeless Youth
  Company Name: Sampo Films LLC
  
  Your gift changes lives.

  Outside In will also mail you a letter in recognition of your generosity. If you have questions, please reply to this email or call **************.

  On behalf of our entire organization, thank you again!

  ***********************
  Executive Director
  Outside In
  

*Some consumers may elect to not publish the details of their complaints, some complaints may not meet BBB's standards for publication, or BBB may display a portion of complaints when a high volume is received for a particular business. ↩