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Wisconsin

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Description

This company offers the sales and service of new and used automotbiles.

BBB Accreditation

A BBB Accredited Business since

BBB has determined that John Paul’s Automotive meets BBB accreditation standards, which include a commitment to make a good faith effort to resolve any consumer complaints. BBB Accredited Businesses pay a fee for accreditation review/monitoring and for support of BBB services to the public.

BBB accreditation does not mean that the business' products or services have been evaluated or endorsed by BBB, or that BBB has made a determination as to the business' product quality or competency in performing services.

Reason for Rating

BBB rating is based on 16 factors. Get the details about the factors considered.

Factors that raised the rating for John Paul’s Automotive include:

  • Length of time business has been operating.
  • Complaint volume filed with BBB for business of this size.
  • Response to 8 complaint(s) filed against business.
  • Resolution of complaint(s) filed against business.
  • BBB has sufficient background information on this business.


Customer Complaints Summary Read complaint details

8 complaints closed with BBB in last 3 years | 1 closed in last 12 months
Complaint Type Total Closed Complaints
Advertising/Sales Issues 1
Billing/Collection Issues 0
Delivery Issues 0
Guarantee/Warranty Issues 0
Problems with Product/Service 7
Total Closed Complaints 8

Customer Reviews Summary Read customer reviews

2 Customer Reviews on John Paul’s Automotive
Customer Experience Total Customer Reviews
Positive Experience 1
Neutral Experience 0
Negative Experience 1
Total Customer Reviews 2

Additional Information

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BBB file opened: January 01, 1968 Business started: 08/01/1968 in WI Business started locally: 08/01/1968 Business incorporated: 11/06/1997 in WI
Licensing, Bonding or Registration

This business is in an industry that may require professional licensing, bonding or registration. BBB encourages you to check with the appropriate agency to be certain any requirements are currently being met.

These agencies may include:

Wisconsin Department of Transportation
4802 Sheboygan Avenue, P.O. Box 7910, Madison WI 53707
http://www.dot.state.wi.us
Phone Number: (800) 924-3570
driverrecords.dmv@dot.wi.gov

Wisconsin Department of Financial Institutions
345 W. Washington Ave. 4th Floor, Madison WI 53703
http://www.wdfi.org
Phone Number: (608) 266-1064
askthesecretary@dfi.state.wi.us

Type of Entity

Corporation

Business Management
Ms. Cathy L. Jones, President Mr. J. Philip Jones, Dealer Ms. Cherie Fitzpatrick, Treasurer/Secretary Mr. John Jones, President
Contact Information
Principal: Ms. Cathy L. Jones, President
Principal: Mr. J. Philip Jones, Dealer
Business Category

Auto Dealers - New Cars Auto Dealers - Used Cars Auto Parts & Supplies - New Tire Dealers Auto Air Conditioning Alternators & Generators - Auto Repair Auto Diagnostic Service Auto Electric Service Auto Repair & Service Brake Service Engines - Rebuild & Exchange Lubricating Service - Automotive Mufflers & Exhaust Systems Transmissions - Automobile Truck Repair & Service Wheel Alignment, Frame & Axle Service - Auto Auto Repair - Tune-Up Auto Repair - Maintenance New Car Dealers (NAICS: 441110)

Products & Services

John Paul’s Automotive sells the following brand(s): Buick, GMC

Alternate Business Names
Greenfield Pontiac-Buick, Inc. John Paul's Buick GMC
Industry Tips
Auto Repair and Services Auto-Buyback Guarantee-Terms & Conditions for Consumers Protecting Your Auto Repair Investment

Additional Locations

  • 3615 S 108th St

    Milwaukee, WI 53228 (414) 545-7000 (800) 236-7901 (855) 228-2108 (855) 228-2109 (414) 455-2015 (414) 455-2017

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Professional AffiliationsX
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Types of Complaints Handled by BBB

BBB handles the following types of complaints between businesses and their customers so long as they are not, or have not been, litigated:

  • Advertising or Sales
  • Billing or Collection
  • Problems with Products or Services
  • Delivery
  • Guarantee or Warranty

We do not handle workplace disputes, discrimination claims or claims about the quality of health or legal services.

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BBB Complaint Process

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Additional Phone Numbers

  • (414) 455-2015(Phone)
  • (414) 455-2017(Phone)
  • (800) 236-7901(Phone)
  • (855) 228-2108(Phone)
  • (855) 228-2109(Phone)
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Complaint Detail(s)

1/21/2014 Problems with Product/Service | Read Complaint Details
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Additional Notes

Complaint: We spoke to John ****’s used car manager directly on 12/29/2013 and inquired about a specific car advertised for sale on their webpage. He told us that the car was available and “very nice” and ‘on special sale’. My wife, who was to be the actual purchaser, and I went to John ****’s lot on 12/30/2013 to check out the car in question. Clearly, this car was not “very nice”. Not only did the car have rust and other cosmetic issues not apparent on the webpage photo, the salesperson said the car had a exhaust leak in addition other mechanical issues and was being sold-as-is. The salesperson told us in order to finance the car, we were required to submit a check for the $500.00 down payment along with the credit application. We told him then that we were caught up in the ****** Store credit/debit card security breech, and that our debit/checking account balance, except for funds required to cover all outstanding checks and direct pay obligations, had been transferred to her savings account while we waited for the bank to mail out new debit cards. Nevertheless, he insisted we had to write them a check in order to even submit our credit application to the finance department. The salesperson convinced us to ‘at least’ write a check for $100.00 “earnest money” in order to show the finance department that we were serious buyers WITH THE PROMISE THAT THE CHECK WOULD NOT BE CASHED until such time that the bank loan was approved. . We were told that when the time came for us to sign the loan papers, we would get her check returned UNCASHED and she could pay the down payment via cashiers check drawn from her savings account. The salesperson submitted our check and credit application to the finance department, returning short time later declaring that no bank would finance that particular car, therefore it would have to be a cash sale. When we declined, he switched us to another vehicle that was newer, with lower miles that he said would qualify for bank financing – However, at over twice the price. Was this the classic ‘bait and switch’? We don’t know, but my wife, needed transportation for work, so we decided to apply for financing for the second car. Several days later we contacted the John ****’s Automotive finance to find out the status of the loan application. We were then told that we needed to put an additional $1000.00 - $1500.00 down for potential bank approval. When we declined, he proposed that we buy a less expensive car – exactly what we tried to do in the first place! We were thinking over his offer two days later when we were contacted by her bank regarding overdraft fees. We arranged for a printout of debit card charges thinking we were victims of the ****** debit/credit security breech. No, we were victims of John ****’s Automotive FAILURE TO KEEP THEIR PROMISE not to cash the $100.00 earnest money check! When contacted and asked to return the money from the cashed check written for the first car, which they could not finance, then apparently applied to the second car, which they could also not finance unless we agreed to change the down payment terms of our offer, which we did not, they refused. John ****’s Automotive initially refused to return the money, saying; “We got a receipt for the check didn’t we – and people only get receipts when they make a payment, right? – Therefore the $100.00 check was a payment to them – What’s the problem? The problem is that this ‘logic’ makes absolutely no sense, especially since the check clearly states “refundable deposit” on the memo line! After much hesitation on their part, they agreed to return our money – promising that they would issue a check and place it in the mail by the end of that very business day. We have not received our money to date! In short, John ****’s were never able to finance us. They outright lied and said they wouldn’t cash our check if they were not able to finance the car we actually did make an offer on – then promptly cashed the check causing us to incur bank overdraft fees, and apparently are now trying to take our money even though the already agreed to return it! We regret ever going to John ****’s Automotive in Greenfield, WI. and cannot, in good conscience, recommend them to any potential car buyer, or to those looking to do business with a forthright car dealership. Clearly, they are not “very nice”.

Desired Settlement: We want John ****’s Automotive to do the right thing and return our money in a timely manner or we will take this further, this time our claim will include all damages/losses, including the bank fees and other incurred expenses.

Business Response: There are a number of issues addressed here so let me just start by apologizing for an experience at our dealership that was less than satisfactory for you. That is never the experience we want our customers to have when doing business with us. In regards to your check being deposited I can only say at this point I am truly sorry for the breakdown in communication that allowed that to happen. When we agree to hold a check until a deal goes through normally it would be tagged as such and that is what would happen. During the middle of the process of your transaction the original salesman that helped you left for an extended leave and regretfully your deal may have not been followed up on as soon as it should have been and if that is the case I apologize for that as well. I can confirm for you that a refund check was mailed to you on 1-15-14 so if you did not receive it today I would think that you should be getting it tomorrow at the latest. Regarding the vehicles that you looked at unfortunately we were not able to put together an acceptable deal for you at this time. The original vehicle due to age and mileage on the vehicle would have required a cash deal as it did not meet the parameters for financing. We did try with various sources to secure financing on the other vehicle. The terms required for the second newer vehicle did not fit your needs so regretfully we were unable to put the deal together. Thank you for giving us the opportunity for your business. We are a family business and our customers are our most valuable asset.

Consumer Response:

[A default letter is provided here which indicates your acceptance of the business's response.  If you wish, you may update it before sending it.]

Better Business Bureau:

 

Thank you for your prompt attention on this matter.

We have reviewed the reply regarding Complaint ID *******. We accept their explanation, and their apology seems sincere. We acknowledge that sometimes things simply go wrong despite our best intentions.

In the end, we have received our refund as agreed. Therefore, in effort to be fair, we wish to withdraw our complaint in its entirety.

Regards,

 

**** And ***** ****

 

 

 

BBB's Final Determination: Consumer accepted resolution offered by the business.

8/29/2013 Problems with Product/Service | Read Complaint Details
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Additional Notes

Complaint: My husband went to this dealership to have four new tires along with other repairs made to his vehicle 13K miles ago on his 2008 Buick (bought from this dealership). My husband has never had this car serviced by another mechanic because he trusted that he was being taken care of by his dealership. The total amount of money spent on this one visit was $697.00. He told the mechanic to complete all repairs needed to his vehicle. Now a little over a year later, one of his new tires is constantly losing air and has to be filled up everyday. My husband assumed he had run over a nail and took it back to the dealership to have it repaired. They informed him that the tire was close to exploding due to the cords sticking out and needed to be repaired immediately. After looking at the tire today, they determined it was due to the fact that the tires were not aligned when they were installed at the dealership. Instead of fixing the mistake that they had made by providing a new tire and alignment, the manager - *** ***** - indicated that my husband is an idiot and spent $700 at their dealership and declined the alignment. I asked if that is indicated in his paperwork from the mechanic and he told me no. But insists that is the only way their service department would not have aligned his tires. My husband DID NOT refuse any service. He walked into the dealership with $1K and was wanting the necessary services performed on his car. And expected the dealership that has been servicing his vehicle for 5 years - with every oil change included - to take care of a loyal customer. Instead they called him an idiot and showed him the door. I've never heard of a place provide worse customer service to a loyal customer that has spent thousands and thousands of dollars at their dealership.

Desired Settlement: Replace the tire that is unable to keep air because your service department did not complete the service as expected when the tires were purchased and installed.

Business Response: Our policy is to work with our customers and to have them leave here completely satisfied. When we do not accomplish that we are truly sorry and will make every attempt to work with the customer to resolve the issue. The customer was very upset at the time of the phone call and that is understandable as there is nothing more frustrating than problems with a vehicle. We would never be disrepectful to our customers and if that's the how it was taken by indicating that we always recommend an alignment with a tire purchase, I can only reaffirm that was never the intent. Mutual respect is a key component to working out an acceptable solution to problems. To rehash the details in this instance would not be helpful as I believe we have come to an agreement with the customer. The important issue is that we want to take care of a loyal customer. We have contacted the customer and I believe we have worked out a mutually acceptable plan to solve the problem with the tires. We value our customers and will always try to go the extra distance.  

Consumer Response:

[A default letter is provided here which indicates your acceptance of the business's response.  If you wish, you may update it before sending it.]

Better Business Bureau:

I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID *******, and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me. A representive from **** **** (***) was extremely respectful and recongnized that we are loyal customers that have spent a lot of money at their business.  We expect good service from this business and have always received that.  It is nice to know that a company will admit their mistake and make up for it.  We are very satisfied with the result.   Thank you.

Regards,

 

***** ******

 

 

 

BBB's Final Determination: Consumer accepted resolution offered by the business.

8/27/2013 Problems with Product/Service | Read Complaint Details
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Additional Notes

Complaint: Signed my car title over to Greenfield Pontiac Buick, Inc. DBA Greenfield Pontiac Buick GMC (John Paul's) on April 14, 2008. I have recently received Storage/Tow Fee Collection Notices from the City of ******* on this vehicle which I no longer own. I have been told by the dealership that they have spoken to someone regarding this matter;but they have no written documentation to provide me with or to the City of *******!!

Desired Settlement: If this issue is not resolved and I have to pay for legal fees, costs/damages, then I am holding Greenfield Pontiac Buick liable and will be looking for compensation!

Business Response: After much research related to this issue, I forwarded to the customer all of the information related to the vehicle trade in which occured in April of 2008. There was a towing issue in June of 2009 which our office manager helped to resolve with an ******** police department at the time it occured.  It was an error that took place more than a year after the vehicle was sold by us at wholesale auction in May of 2008. We faxed other information to the customer as requested on 8-9-13 related to this vehicle. However, in the process of this search we found that information on the current collection issue is not related to that vehicle. Documented by the VIN # on the collection notice the current issue is with a vehicle that we did not sell or have any involvement with at any time. If the customer does not still own that vehicle will need to contact those involved with that transaction and research the title for that vehicle.

BBB's Final Determination: Business offered a resolution. Consumer did not pursue further with BBB and the matter was assumed to be resolved

6/18/2013 Problems with Product/Service | Read Complaint Details
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Additional Notes

Complaint: My husband and I took our GMC to this dealership for an oil leak on 3/4/13. My husband was told that they power washed the oil off and did not find a leak. There was a recall for the transmission filler tube that we did not know about which they took care of but was not the oil leak issue. On 6/4/13 my husband went to check the GMC because we were going out of town and noticed that it was still leaking oil in the same spot. There was oil all over the bottom of the transmission. I called John Paul's, they said bring it in. My husband and I waited for ******* (our previous service person) to get off the phone. We reminded him that we had brought the GMC in March for an oil leak and were told it wasn't leaking. He looked it up and said the only thing he had was for the recall part. ******* said there was nothing about an oil leak. My husband sarted getting upset and raising his voice. He said he wanted it fixed this time and didn't have time for anymore **** My husband asked for a manager. Another man (he never identified himself) came from another desk and said he would try to put it up on a lift so it could be looked at. When that man left, ******* said to my husband " I guess we aren't friends anymore". My husband said "we weren't friends in the first place". My husband said this is **** because ******* kept denying that we brought it in previously in March for an oil leak. ******* said "why didn't you bring in the paper work?" We said " we had it at home and didn't think it was necessary to bring it". ******* started taunting my husband saying "that's the kind of person you are" and kept saying many taunting words to try to get my husband to fly of the handle. My husband said "why don't we stand here and wait for the other man to come back and not say anything to each other". But ******* kept going on and on. The other man (still not identified) was on the other side of the door 2 feet away (of course he could hear us) came through the door and said he could hear my husband yelling and swearing. My husband and I looked at each other, I said "no he wasn't swearing". He was upset from all the taunting words from *******. My husband didn't swear except for **** when ******* was calling him a liar. My husband told the other man what ******* was saying to us but ******* denied saying anything. The other man then told us to leave. My husband said " are you even going to look at it?" The other man said "no, we are not servicing your vehicle, we want you to leave". My husband asked again. The other man said "no, we are not servicing your vehicle, we want you to leave". My husband said " I can't believe the way we were treated here". We left. We took the GMC to another dealership, had it looked at and repaired in one day, no problems or issues. the new dealership said it was a transmission seal that was leaking for a long time. The GMC is under manufacture power train warranty till 1/12/2016. This GMC was not purchased at John Paul's but it is still covered under manufacture warranty. John Paul's is a GMC dealership and close to our house.

Desired Settlement: We would like a written apology from John Paul's of Greenfield.

Business Response:

Regarding recent communication concerning case *******-As with any issue such as this one I will will always research the situation and try to determine what happened and what we could have done better to handle the situation. Customer satisfaction is vital to our business and our policy is to try to give extra effort to have our customers leave completely satisfied. When we are not able to accomplish that, I am truly sorry.

The customer was in our service department in March as they said at which time there was a recall on that model of vehicle that often involved leaking transmission fluid. In many cases fixing the recall issue took care of the leak and nothing more was required. That is the reason they were told that the area was power washed after the recall issue was fixed and they were to check to see if there was actually leakage or if the recall fix took care of the problem. It would have been apparent within a few days if there was a leak aside from the recall issue and follow up could be arranged. No visible leak was determined at the time of initial visit. If that wasn't made clear at the time I apologize for the misunderstanding.

On the day the vehicle was brought back the customer already seemed upset and rather hostile and using profanity and making degrading references to the service advisor. There were a number of other customers on the service drive hearing the exchange. The service manager stepped in to try and calm the customer and take care of the issue. When he stepped inside the office to make arrangements to have the vehicle looked at the customer continued with his offensive remarks and references to the service advisor who is ******* ********. The service manager hearing the exchange stepped back in to try to intervene but the end result,in order to keep the situation from escalating further, he did ask the customer to leave. Our service manager made the decision in that he believed that it was the best action to take at the time to deal with the situation. This is not a common method of handling problems and would only happen in an extreme situation if he felt it was indicated to prevent bigger issues from occurring. This is a manager that has been here many years and goes out of his way on a daily basis to work with customers to solve their problems. The service advisor has been here a number of years as well. Customers often send commendations for the efforts and services provided by both of them. 

I sincerely regret the situation happened as it did. It is not an outcome that we would ever want to happen or that we take lightly. I can understand the frustration when something is wrong with your vehicle when preparing to go on a trip especially if you thought the issue was fixed. Mutual respect and regard for others is necessary in these situations and is the policy we will abide by.

 

***** *****

Consumer Response:

[A default letter is provided here which indicates your acceptance of the business's response.  If you wish, you may update it before sending it.]

Better Business Bureau:

I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID *******, and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me. 

We didn't expect anything more than the response we received especially after reading all the other previous customer service complaints about the dealership.

Regards,

 

***** *****

 

 

 

BBB's Final Determination: Consumer accepted resolution offered by the business.

4/18/2013 Problems with Product/Service | Read Complaint Details
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Additional Notes

Complaint: I purchased a **** ********* **** from John Paul Automotive in December, the first day I saw the truck I noticed the rear bumper was dented and that wasn't really on the photos. I drove the truck and decided that if this bumper was fixed this truck could be the right vehicle. *******, the sales rep who helped me make this purchase, explained that the dealership wouldn't be able to pay for the bumper but would install the bumper I purchased onto the vehicle. I explained that I couldn't spend a lot of money on a bumper and so ******* helped me find some examples of a bumper online, most of which cost between $175 and $270 depending on if the bumper was used or new. So I was planning on getting this repair done for around $250 max, and so I agreed to the purchase. Within a week of the purchase things started going wrong with this vehicle, and I quickly racked up around $1500 in repairs to the engine, power steering, and brakes. Parts included, power steering pump/booster, MAF, spark plugs, crankshaft position sensor, wires, and camshaft position sensor, and fuel filter. Finally after all of these repairs I still have a truck that runs like garbage and still needs a new bumper. So I purchase the bumper and have it delivered this is a bumper that was designed and made for this specific vehicle. I make the appointment with the service ******* to bring my truck in at 7:00am on a Monday morning, and pick it back up at 4:30-5:00 that evening. I then proceed to show up for my appointment at 7:00am which is an hour from my home so now I am driving an hour, missing an hour of work just to get this bumper swapped out on the truck at John Paul Automotive. I receive a call from the service ******* shortly before lunch about the dealership needing more than just the bumper in order to complete this repair, he said he would contact the used car *******, and then get back to be and re-assured me they would take care of the problem. I didn't get a call back and so needing to get my vehicle back I arrived at the dealership in order to get there before the shop closed, so I got there around 5:00pm and was told to go to the cashier for my vehicle, at the cashier I was told my vehicle wasn't done and was approched by the used car *******, and the service ******* and escorted to the body shop where the service ******* and body shop ******* explained to me that I needed to replace the bumper assembly or purchase another $466 dollars worth of parts in order to replace the bumper. Now I have lost 2 hours of work, spent 2 hours driving back and forth, only to get an estimate which would put my total cost for this repair at $700+ plus $200 in lost wages and expense. After discussion with the service ******* and the body shop ******* they suggested that I discuss the situation with the sales person as this was obviously much more money than initially expected. I called ******* and explained that this repair was much more expensive to complete and asked him to rectify the problem in some way, and he answered that he didn't know anything about my visit and that he would discuss the situation and get back to me later that day, he did get back to me later that day but only to tell me he couldn't talk to the *******s and that he would call me back within 24 hours with some kind of solution. The next day I did not hear back from ******* and so I waited another day and he did call me back the following day and stated that there was nothing left for him to do and that I'd need to purchase an entire assembly or the $466 in parts in order for the repair to be completed and that the *******s both explained that to me.

Desired Settlement: It' very clear that John Paul Automotive has no desire to stand behind their vehicle nor their sales practices. This vehicle was in their shop for some time and obviously had been looked at from a cost perspective prior to even putting it on the lot for sale. The dealership knew about the added expense and probably some of the other things that were about to go wrong on this truck. The salesperson told me an incorrect repair amount in order to get me to purchase this vehicle. I wouldn't have gone through with the purchase had I known that this particular repair was going to cost me more than $700. I would like John Paul Automotive to stand by the original intent of this agreement which was to replace the bumper once I had supplied the bumper itself, however, I cannot trust them to work diligently at this point so I'd like them to refund me 1/2 of the $700 in estimated cost for this repair, which will cover the labor for another professional to install the bumper, the $90 the bumper cost me to ship back to and return to Autoparts Warehouse, and the $200 in lost wages and time it took for me to get to and from this appointment where my truck didn't get a new bumper which I had provided as indicated in the original agreement, for a total refund of $640, which at the end of the day may still not entirely pay for a new bumper so I will most likely still need to pay around $200 out of pocket for this repair to be completed at another shop.

Business Response: Our goal at John Paul's Buick GMC is that our customers are completely satisfied. That did not happen in this case and for that I sincerely apologize. We were able to contact the customer today after trying several times and have aranged to take care of the problem with the bumper as originally planned. We do care very much about our customers and will stand behind our commitments to them. Customer satisfaction is a vital component of our business. Whenever a situation of this nature arises we try to determine what went wrong and what we can do better in the future. The commitment was made to install the bumper provided by the customer and we will do that. I am sorry that this issue was not taken care of when it was initially brought in and regret the inconvenience it caused. We appreciate the opportunity to make this right for our customer.

Consumer Response:

Better Business Bureau:

I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID *******, and have determined that this does not resolve my complaint.  For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below.

I did discuss the complaint with the dealership and was pressured into simply bringing my vehicle back to the dealer at my expense and on my own time. I originally agreed that this would be acceptable, however, I don't feel like the business has my best interest in mind and after being asked 5 times on the call if I would be willing to redact my complaint I feel like this dealership is simply trying to protect themselves. I will be calling them back next week to offer a solution which does not include them fixing my truck as I simply cannot trust them at this point. The original agreement was to buy a bumper and they would install it,  I try to get the bumper replaced as we agreed I simply have to pay more money for extra parts, losing an extra $90 in shipping and restocking fees so that the dealership can save money?!? How is that solving the problem?

The only solution I will accept at this point is a refund from the dealer in the amount of $350 which will cover my expenses for time, the shipping and restocking fee of the old bumper, and the cost to have another dealer install a new bumper.

Regards,

******* *********

 

 

Business Response: I have personally been in contact with the customer and believe that we we have agreed on a mutually acceptable resolution to the complaint. Once again i will say that customer satisfaction is a vital component of our business and I regret that we did not meet our goal of having our customer leave here completely satisfied.

Consumer Response:

[A default letter is provided here which indicates your acceptance of the business's response.  If you wish, you may update it before sending it.]

Better Business Bureau:

I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID *******, and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me.  Upon receipt of the agreed upon resolution I would gladly consider this complaint resolved.

Regards,

 

******* *********

 

 

 

BBB's Final Determination: Consumer accepted resolution offered by the business.

2/5/2013 Problems with Product/Service | Read Complaint Details
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Additional Notes

Complaint: I took my 2011 GMC Denali to an authorized GMC dealer due to factory recalls, transmission jerking, squeaky breaks and misaligned headlights. I had recently purchased this vehicle from another dealer with 6,000 miles on it, so I figured it had never been serviced before. The gentleman asked if he could keep the truck overnight and I agreed. I received a call that the truck was ready and went to pick it up. As soon as I got into the truck and turned it on, I noticed that the headlights were still not lined correctly. I got out of the vehicle to take a look and that is when I noticed that my truck had sustained damage while in the possession of the dealership. It appeared to me that someone had hit something with my front bumper. I went back into the service department to report my find and was treated very poorly. The service man started yelling at me saying "he was not going to take the blame for this," and threatened to "call the police and have me arrested if I did not get off his property." I decided to call the police myself since I was being threatened and knew this issue was not going to be resolved directly. A police officer agreed with me that the gentleman was not acting appropriate and he also agreed it seemed as if the gentleman was hiding something. It was the police officer that suggested using the Better Business Bureau to assist me in resolving this issue and to charge the dealer the full cost of repairing the bumper and any other costs I may accrue having my truck reassessed at a different qualified GMC dealer. At this point I cannot trust that any work has been done to my truck. I am 100% certain this damage was not there when I dropped the car off at 8 am that morning. The reason I know this is because I had just washed and waed the truck by hand the night before and had not left my heated garage until arriving at the dealership. No accidents occurred driving to the dealership.

Desired Settlement: John Paul's Automotive to pay for full repair of my bumper and any other costs that may accrue having my truck reassessed at a different qualified GMC dealer.

Business Response:

Our goal at John Paul's is that our customers leave here completely satisfied. Sometimes, depite our efforts that doesn't happen. We have reviewed the situation and will share our perspective. The customer's frustration is understandable in that our service department attempted to but was unable to recreate the transmisssion, brake noise and electrical issues for which the vehicle was brought in, thus the concerns could not be properly diagnosed and repaired. We were able to take care of the recall issue. This type of situation is indeed frustrating to everyone. I'm sorry that we could not fix the other areas of concern. Prior to his returning to pick up the vehicle, he was made aware of the situation and also advised that the left headlamp was slightly lower than the right by design for this style of headlamp to avoid blinding oncoming traffic. The headlamps were aftermarket design. He seemed cordial on the phone but became unhappy when he arrived and seemed irritated with everyone. The service shop manager and customer service manager spent time trying to help the customer. The customer service manager went with him to check out at the cashiers' window and accompanied him to look at the vehicle at which time he pointed out that the headlights were still not aligned properly. While they were walking back to the building, he turned around and said"What's that" and started to point out several chips/areas of peeling paint in four different areas on the front bumper cover of the vehicle. The multiple locations alone would make it not feasible for us to have caused the problem with anything we did while attempting to service his vehicle. Likewise, if we had caused or even felt there was the chance that the damage was caused while in our care, we would have said so and taken care of it.

The service shop manager stepped in to try and assist with the situation as the customer became more agitated. He was advised that we would try to help but he needed to refrain from the profanity. Regarding the headlights, the customer was advised that we could adjust them if he wished but that since they were aftermarket headlights and not original to the vehicle from General Motors, any adjustments made would not be covered by the factory warranty and that he would be responsible for the charges. He declined. He then continued to focus on what he said was damage we had caused to the vehicle. The customer called the police when he was told that we would not be held responsible for damage that did not occur while the vehicle was in our care. He continued to question the integrity of and make accusations toward the service writer who had helped him as he was trying to explain to the manager how his prior conversations with the customer had gone. Emotions were running high by then and the service writers responses could have been less professional than would normally be expected amid the ongoing profanity and unmerited accusations from the customer. As to what the officer may have said to him we have no direct knowledge so can't respond to that. We are never happy when a customer is dissatisfied; however situations such as this call for mutual respect. Nothing happened while the vehicle was here to cause any damage to the vehicle or we would have taken care of it. While I am sorry that we were unable to solve the original issues with the vehicle, I belive the complaint that the truck was damged here is unmerited.

Consumer Response:

Better Business Bureau:

I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID *******, and have determined that this does not resolve my complaint.  For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below.

The fact that the issues with the transmission and breaks could not be recreated certainly was not the problem.  The headlights are so out of line it's laughable.  That being said, that would not cause me to get that upset.  I can have a good friend of mine from a reputable shop realign them correctly.  The fact that they caused damage to my front bumper is the problem, and a huge problem.  The area they damaged is very clear and is not spread out as they claim.  They clearly ran into something causing damage to the passenger side of the front bumper taking paint off and due to the low temperature that day caused a spider effect of cracking paint around the impact area.  It's when something like that is pointed out and the business does not take responsibility for that damage that clearly was not there upon arrival is very upsetting, but it was their unprofessional language and actions that brought forth police involvement.  My understanding is that I'm not the first complaint they've had for poor service, and can guarantee I won't be the last.

Regards,

***** *****

 

Business Response: Once more I will say that our goal at John Paul's is that our customers are completely satisfied when they leave here. When we do not meet that goal as in this case we try to determine what went wrong and what we can do better. Customer satisfaction is an essential component of our business. We are in contact once again with this customer and wil do our best to come to a mutually agreeable resolution.

Consumer Response:

[A default letter is provided here which indicates your acceptance of the business's response.  If you wish, you may update it before sending it.]

Better Business Bureau:

I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID *******, and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me. 

Regards,

***** *****

 

BBB's Final Determination: Consumer accepted resolution offered by the business.

1/20/2013 Problems with Product/Service | Read Complaint Details
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Additional Notes

Complaint: After finding a 2003 *** ****** ****** for sale online at this dealership I called & spoke with the used car ******* to inquire about it on 12/1/12. He assured me that everything was good with the truck plus that Wisconsin has a law that requires them to list any problems with a used vehicle & that this truck had no problems. This being the case I then made an offer on the truck & said that I could be there on 12/8/12 to purchase it in full. He accepted my offer. I flew in 1,200 miles from ******, ** to make the purchase but naturally I had to test drive the truck first (which drove fine) & inspect it. When I looked under the truck I saw oil drops under the oil filter so I asked my salesman if it could be put on a lift for a better look of the undercarriage since the dealership has a service department & he was able to arrange this. Upon further inspection I found oil residue at the rear differential, oil covering half of the front axle as well as a line with oil on it which appeared to be leaking because it had a drop of oil under it so I took pictures of all 4 areas. I pointed this out to my salesman so he went & found a mechanic who told me that the oil residue was simply "seepage" which was nothing to worry about. He said that the oil on the filter & front axle was from when they had changed the oil on the truck & it didn't get cleaned up. He sprayed break cleaner on the filter & said it was good to go. I then pointed out the line with oil on it & he told me that it was definitely leaking and not seepage but that I would have to go wait in the waiting area since my salesman wasn't currently present. I then told my salesman that the mechanic confirmed that there was a leak so he mentioned this to used car ******* who said that he would get his main mechanic to take a look. A while later he returned & told me that there was nothing wrong with the truck so I told him that I wanted to show him my concerns. When we got back to the shop the oil drop from the line in question had been wiped off. I told him that another mechanic had told me it was leaking & not seepage but the used car ******* said "leaking, seepage, whatever". I then asked if the engine could be started while the truck was on the lift to see if we could see it leaking & he said we couldn’t do that while it was raised. I then asked if it could be lowered, have the engine idle for 5 minutes & then raise it again to see if the leak continued & he said no. He said that we could take the truck out of the shop & let it idle but that I would have to crawl under it if I wanted to check it which I agreed to. After the truck idled for a while I managed to get under it & saw that the line which had been wiped off continued to slowly leak. I told my salesman that the line was still leaking & that if the used car ******* didn't want to fix it that if he'd be willing to deduct the repair cost from the sale price. He then went into the office & closed the door. I was looking in that direction the whole time and I could hear the used car ******* loud and clear though the closed door say that the only reason I wanted them to put the truck on the lift was so that I could finding something wrong and get more knocked off the price. He then said that he had already came down from the asking price so he wasn't coming down anymore. The salesman then came out and told me that he had said no but I told him that I had heard every word he said as to why and that I did not appreciate being accused of something that was false. I was told that everything was in working order so I flew out there to make the purchase only to find out differently. I could not pay that amount for a truck that turns out was not in working order. I called the dealership on 12/10/12 and asked to speak with the ***** and I then asked her for email address so that I could list all details of what happened as well as the pictures that I took so that she could see for herself. She replied quickly to say she would look into it and by the next day she replied again with her findings. She did apologize for me having an unpleasant experience but did say that the conclusion is that the truck is expected to have seepage because of its age but that no leakage was found and that they could not find the mechanic who told me that line was definitely leaking. She also said that they had another mechanic who specializes in trucks to check it out & he found nothing wrong.

Desired Settlement: The desired outcome would've been for the used car ******* to have either fixed the leak or deduct the cost of the repair from the sale price and if he was adamant that he was not going to do either then he could've at least been professional about it. Prior to me going out there I had offered to pay for an oil change if it was due - I didn't ask for a free one so for him to think that I was looking for a discount is insulting. I just wanted for everything to be in order on the truck for the 1,200 commute back to ******. Since I flew back to ****** that same day there's nothing else that can be done.

Business Response:

First of all, today's notice states second request, I have searched my email and can find no other email from BBB regarding this issue or I would have responded right away. I did talk with this customer and responded through emails as well. Unfortunately in this situation because of the way things happened and the distance involved the only thing we could do after the fact was sincerely apologize for the experience he had at our dealership. I did research the situation and looked at our presentation of the truck and at the state buyers guide that is required for all used vehicles sold here. The truck was 10 model years old but had been well cared for as documented by the car fax, looked beautiful, and drove well. The truck had been inspected, had the oil changed and was confirmed by our technician that the oil residue at the differential was seepage which is not abnormal for a vehicle of this age. On the day the customer was here it was determined that the small amount of oil on the filter and axle was from an incomplete clean up when they changed the oil which the technician told him at the time. We had another technician that specialized in trucks that was not here on Saturday look at the truck later and his conclusion was exactly the same. I have not been able to find anyone that says they told the customer it was leaking. We should have done a better clean up job initially. On the day he came, a busy Saturday, we could have offered to have it cleaned throughly so that he could have watched it further but at that point if it would have made a difference I don't know. As with matters of this nature, we can always "what if" but in situations such as this one, that really isn't helpful after the fact. Our goal is always to have the customer leave completely satisfied. We did not meet that goal here. I am truly sorry about that.  We had held the truck for a week as requested, picked him up at the airport, offered a discount already due to the distance he was traveling, and did not believe that there was an issue warranting repair or we would have repaired it. He decided not to buy the truck and left.  The customer came a long way and I sincerely regret the way things ended up. I am aware that he feels he was treated unprofessionally and  I apologize for that as well as that is never our intention.  He stated in his desired settlement "Since I flew back to ****** that same day there's nothin else that can be done." I sincerely hope that he is able to find a similar truck that better meets his expectations. Again, at this point I can only reaffirm that I am sorry he left dissatisfied and for the unpleasant experiencehe feels he had at our dealership. 

Consumer Response:

Better Business Bureau:

     I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID *******, and have determined that this does not resolve my complaint.  For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below.

     I am not denying that the truck looked fine & drove well. With it being a used truck plus it being 10 years old it’s a given that it’s not going to be perfect. The problem that I have is being told that everything was in working order when in fact it was not & I have the pictures to prove it. I showed the picture of the leaking oil line to a mechanic after I got back to ****** & he told me that the line appeared to be leaking based on the oil residue on the line plus the oil drop which was circled in red. The same picture shows another oil line behind it which has no oil residue or drips at all which is how both lines should look. The mess that was left behind after the oil change had nothing to do with the oil drip on the line since it was nowhere near the oil filter or oil plug. Again, this is clearly seen in the pictures that were provided. To say that “the small amount of oil on the filter and axle was from an incomplete clean up when they changed the oil” is an understatement because it looks like there was no clean up attempt at all. Isn’t this a requirement, at least for environmental reasons? What does this say about the dealership’s service department as far as making a very noticeable mess & not doing anything about it?

     Either way the mess left behind was not an issue but the leaking oil line was. The main mechanic that was at the dealership that day just wiped off the oil line with a rag & said it was fine. I’m no mechanic but I have enough sense to know that wiping off an oil drip with a rag isn’t going to fix the leak. If one is in the market of purchasing a 10-year old house & is told that everything is in working order but the person finds that one of the faucets has a drip even though it’s closed I do believe that he or she will expect for the problem to get fixed. A mechanic doesn’t have to “specialize in trucks” to know that there is a problem – especially after one of the mechanics from that dealerships told me that it was indeed leaking. I regret not getting the technician’s name but I know what I was told by him. Another issue that I found which was minor was that the puddle lamps (lights under the exterior mirrors that light up when hitting the unlock button on the remote) did not light up. I mentioned this to the salesman. I’m assuming that the bulbs just needed replacing but I guess we’ll never know. When I’m assured that everything is in working order I expect for those to work as well. I guess this was also overlooked by the technician who specializes in trucks.

     The used car sales ******* being completely unprofessional was totally uncalled for. When he made the comment about “leakage, seeping, whatever” it was obvious that he didn’t care about the truck’s condition. He knew that he had me in a tough situation being that I flew there one-way so I could either buy the truck with the leak or I could find another way back to ******. I asked him if I could take another look at oil line in question on the lift in the shop after letting the engine idle for a little while & he said no, that if I wanted to take another look that I could have to crawl under it in the parking lot. So, that’s what I did. It was 37 degrees outside but I could not risk driving back to ****** with an oil leak. Then, for him to accuse me of wanting them to put the truck on the lift just so I could find something wrong with it to get more knocked off the price was a complete insult. This I heard loud & clear though the closed door in his office because he was shouting quite clearly. This man represents the dealership & this is how he treats a potential customer?

     It doesn’t matter that this isn’t his nature. He can’t undo what he did. I did everything I was supposed to do on my end. I went & purchased a cashier’s check to pay for the truck in full. I purchased insurance for the truck to make it legal to drive back. I flew up there & arrived when I was supposed to. Since I did everything that was required of me I expected for the dealership to do the same but instead I get insulted & end up having to pay for a taxi ride back to the airport & then have to purchase a last minute one-way ticket back home which didn’t come cheap.

     Yes, I did state that nothing else could be done since I flew back to ******. This applies to the purchase of the truck. This doesn’t mean that the dealership can’t make things right. I ended up spending a little over $400 in the end to go up there & fly back. If they were to reimburse me for half of what I spent I would accept it & gladly drop the complaint. The ball is in their court.

 

Regards,

*** *********

 

 

BBB's Final Determination: Business offered a resolution. Consumer did not pursue further with BBB and the matter was assumed to be resolved

8/24/2012 Advertising/Sales Issues | Read Complaint Details
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Additional Notes

Complaint: My wife and I were looking for a reasonably priced *** *******. On July 31, 2012 we inquired via telephone/web about a slightly used one listed on their website. We were upfront with the sales person about how much we were looking to spend. We clearly laid out how much we were putting down and how much we were looking to take on in a monthly payment. We were told multiple times that it wouldn't be a problem for the dealership to meet those numbers, and that they would be able to make that work for us with either the used one (which the sales person claimed had more features) or a new one (the base model). We asked for clear pricing before traveling to the dealership, as we didn't want to waste our time going down there. We were told that to give us the prices, we had to submit the information for a credit check. Even though we were hesitant to do so, we did it. After they ran a credit check, they then refused to give out a price quote over the phone or via email. The salesperson repeatedly said that they can meet our numbers, that it had been cleared with the manager, and that there would not be any problems. So, we went to the dealership. When we got to the dealership, it was clear that we had been lied to. The used vehicle was a base *** ******* with no additional features. The salesperson did not have an offer prepared, and she had not cleared our numbers with anyone at the dealership. We sat there for two hours while she kept talking with the manager and/or finance guy and kept coming back with offers that were thousands of dollars more expensive than what we were looking to spend and/or that were offered online. These were not the prices that she agreed to over the phone and repeatedly told us they could meet. I may have been hallucinating, but I think the price of the vehicle actually kept increasing as we sat there! This was a complete waste of hours of our night and the gas to drive to the dealership. We should have been told over the phone that they were not going to meet our prices.

Desired Settlement: This company needs to change its deceptive and deceitful tactics. They also need to apologize to me for wasting my time. I also expect reimbursement for the gas it cost me to drive there, for the depreciation on my vehicle, and for my time that was wasted.

Business Response:

***** ***** ******** **********

 

BBB of Wisconsin

 

10101 W. Greenfield Ave., Ste.125

 

Milwaukee, WI 53214

 

August 22, 2012

 

Dear Ms. ******:

**********

 

p.2

 

I am responding to the complaint filed against John Paul's Automotive. The assigned 10 number is *******.
I have spent some time gathering information, reading the e-mails, talking to those involved, etc. No doubt there was miscommunication or the occurrence would not have happened as it did. Contrary to the accusations made, we are an organization that cares deeply about our customers, andwe strive always to operate with honest and ethical business practices. Customer satisfaction is a criticalcomponent of our business I personally called the customer on August 21st to hear his concerns and to apologize for the experience he had at our business. I don't believe he was Intentionally misled and lured in to coming in to waste his time, he does. To rehash that at this point in time serves no purpose. I can only say that I am truly sorry for the experience that he had. That is never the outcome we want for our customers. As for our customer satisfaction representative not responding to his first email, we have still not been able to locate it. I did have in front of me the second one from Aug. 17th when I spoke with him. Certainly occurrences such as this cause us to stop and review what we are doing or what we can do better in the future. He did say that his wife had been here far service several times and had been treated well so they had decided ta shop for the vehicle here. Some pretty cruel and damagingaccusations and demands were made In anger at the situation on his part. We can only work harder toovercome that at this point. There are many variables when purchasing a vehicle. We tried, but were unable to meet the expectations that he had. I take situations such as this very personally because ultimately it is my name on the line and that of my late husband. Our ultimate goal will continue to be to have each customer leave here "completely satisfied". We will not be perfect because we are human; but, we will keep trying.

Sincerely,

***** ** ***** 

 

President

Home

 

of Maximum Vah,e & Maximum Savings

 

P.O. Box 20878

3615 S.

 

108th St.

 

Greenfield. \VI 53228

Ph. ###-###-####

Fax ###-###-####

***************************

Consumer Response: Better Business Bureau:I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID *******, and have determined that this does not resolve my complaint.  For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below.

I sincerely hope that Mrs. ***** continues to investigate this matter. However, she does not commit to reforming the misleading and deceptive business practices occurring at the dealership, nor does she offer much in the way of apologies or compensation. She also attempts to minimize my complaints by calling them a "miscommunication." There was no miscommunication. We clearly told the sales people up front what vehicle we were interested in and what price we wanted to pay. They said they could meet those numbers. When we arrived, they never once showed us a price anywhere close to the numbers we had previously discussed. This is misleading, deceptive, and illegal.

If Mrs. ***** does not take my complaints seriously, then I will be forced to seek alternative means to resolve this dispute.

 

Regards,

**** *******

 

 

Consumer Response:

[A default letter is provided here which indicates your acceptance of the business's response.  If you wish, you may update it before sending it.]

Better Business Bureau:

I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID *******, and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me. 

I recently responded to a response with a rejection. After submitting the rejection notice, I spoke once again with the owner of John Paul's Automotive. While I am not completely satisfied, I now consider this matter closed.

If there are any questions, please let me know

Thank you,

**** *******
--
**** *******
Attorney at Law
**********************
###-###-####
Admitted in Illinois and Wisconsin


 

 

BBB's Final Determination: Business offered a partial (less than 100%) settlement which the consumer accepted