Bank pretends to be courteous and professional to lock in services with you. Afterward, you are treated poorly.
We opened an account with this bank to refinance an auto loan. I should have stayed with the bank I was with prior to this one. Per conditions laid out for us upon application of the auto loan, we opened a checking and savings account to reduce our percentage rate of interest. We had no intention to utilize these accounts, as we have banked with Chase for several years without any problems whatsoever. During the Christmas season, we received a bonus check and decided to deposit it into the checking account to serve as an "emergency fund" for the future. We added an additional $*** to that account a while later. Since we didn't have a card for the account, we assumed the money was safely tucked away - only to be remembered when we absolutely needed it. I never received an account statement from them since opening the account. I didn't even realize we were supposed to receive paper statements. When one of us attempted to access the online account to check the balances in September 2013, we found out that online access had been restricted. Our work hours did not correspond with their hours of operation and there is no phone for after-hours like every other bank we've dealt with. When we finally were able to go the bank, we found out that the balance was $*** less than what it should have been. I immediately phoned in the next day, but was told that it was beyond a 6-week window to file a claim. I asked what I was supposed to do about $*** stolen from our account. The teller said, "You're just going to have to deal with it. We can't do anything about it and there's nothing you can do either." Word-for-word. I've never felt so disrespected in regard to business before! Especially over that much money! After work laid off a bunch of us, I was forced to forego making payments on the credit card we had with the bank. I started receiving phone calls every week from them and letters in the mail threatening legal action if I didn't respond within 48 hours or so. When I tried to make arrangements to get caught up, the CSR was rude and kept speaking over me. Now that I am re-employed, I attempted to take care of all my past debts (this account included) by settling for a lump-sum payment and starting to build my credit again. This bank refuses to work with you at all. When I pleaded my case, I was told that I should have paid attention to my statements or logged in to my online account. As stated, I never received statements. Ever. I was also not able to access the online account for months, despite having told them and being told that they reset the account. I still cannot access it to this day. These interactions come from someone who had a 758 credit score by the time they were 21. That is unheard of! So this wasn't for lack of effort in taking care of my responsibilities. This was a complete and utter case of ineptitude on the banks part. I DO NOT understand how an account that was NEVER used for purchases could suddenly be debited of $600 over the course of a month and half without raising flags to the owner of the account. This could have been easily avoided by proper banking tactics. Be wary new customers!
They can have the automobile too, as it's not even worth 25% of the loan I've paid on regularly for 3 years now. I quit. Lesson Learned: Do NOT bank with Fire Police City County Federal Credit Union.
I would more than happily settle my credit card account for the balance minus the $*** that they lost. I would also accept the return of my $***. The only other option is bankruptcy on this file. They can have the automobile too, as it's not even worth 25% of the loan I've paid on regularly for 3 years now. I quit. Lesson Learned: Do NOT bank with Fire Police City County Federal Credit Union.
Contact Name and Title: ***** ******, Marketing
Contact Phone: XXX-XXX-XXXX
Contact Email: ************@fpccfcu.org
On January 7, 2014, ***** ******** called Fire Police City County FCU to report that he had unauthorized charges on his account. He said that all the debit card transactions from March 2013 through August 2013 were not his. Several of the charges were made using the PIN, which we had changed per *****'s in-person request on June 4, 2012 and again on November 2, 2012. ***** was asked if he had told anyone what his PIN was; he specifically said "he made all his PINs the same number." Upon research, ***** was notified that the charges could not be disputed with Visa, because they were outside of Visa's 60 day dispute timeframe. He was indeed told that if he had notified the Credit Union sooner, we could have disputed the charges. He said that he wasn't receiving statements, so he didn't know the charges were being made. He was reminded that he had requested and signed to receive electronic statements, which he would access through Perfect Teller, our home banking program. ***** said that he had been locked out of home banking almost 6 months, shouted some obscenities and hung up. He then called Credit Union Card Center (our card provider) to file the dispute, and was told by them that the purchases happened outside the time frame and were not eligible for dispute. His response to the CUCC employee was violent enough that a manager called the Credit Union to warn management of the situation.
*****'s claim that he was locked out of Perfect Teller was researched. The Credit Union put a home banking lockout on his account on October 15, 2013 because we had no valid contact information for him. We had been trying to contact Mr. ******** pursuant to our collection policy. Upon further research, it was discovered that *****'s account was accessed through Perfect Teller 18 times during the March 2013 through September 2013. An access attempt was blocked on October 15, 2013, after the lockout was placed, and no further attempts were made until December 3, 2013.
To address *****'s points directly:
***** signed up for a debit card on the day he opened the account. The Credit Union even replaced his original debit card per his request, because "he needed the card to read ** ****** ******** or **** ********, instead of ***** ********."
***** requested and signed up for electronic statements on the day he opened the account, which is why he never received a paper statement.
***** claims that either he or the joint owner attempted to access their account online, but were unable to in September 2013. The only access attempt in September was successful; access was blocked by the Credit Union on October 15.
***** claims that he is still unable to access his account online. On February 6, 2014, the account was accessed successfully on Perfect Teller.
***** claims that there is no after-hours phone. Our after-hours emergency extension is given by the system every time someone calls the Credit Union.
It has also been determined that the auto loan Mr. ******** mentions is being paid by the
co-maker, who requested payroll deduction payments. Mr. ******** has made no attempt to pay or make arrangements on his delinquent VISA. The **** to which Mr. ******** mentions that was "lost" was due to his negligence, not the fault of the Credit Union.
(The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)
Yes, we had a card associated with the Checking account upon first establishing the account. When we decided that we would NOT be closing our account with JPMorgan Chase Bank, we disposed of both the cards for that account. Also, I only requested a PIN# change ONCE. I have used the same PIN on all my debit cards my entire life. It would not make sense to change a PIN a SECOND time. Perhaps you are seeing a PIN number change on Vinh's card as well. I, however, have only requested my PIN be changed ONCE.
The first phone call with FPCCFCU that you have written of is not entirely accurate. After stating that I had been unable to access the online banking for quite some time, the bank representative stated that I would have to have my account reset and get a new access code for verification purposes upon my next sign-in. When I inquired whether the fact that I had been unable to access the account would change whether they would be able to dispute the charges, the teller I spoke with rudely informed me otherwise. I asked her what it was I was expected to do, and her response was, "*****, there's nothing you can do. It is outside of the window frame for filing fraud. You're just going to have to deal with it. You have no option here." Her tone of voice was entirely disconcerting. I told her, "Well that's not true at all, I can sue you!" She responded (with a very rude scoff) "(HA!) Good luck with that!" I told her she was rude, and yes, profanity was used. I immediately hung up and called the Credit Union Card Service line.
I find the statement from FPCCFCU's representative regarding my, "violent response" to the Credit Union Card Service to be ludicrous. I am the most soft-spoken person anyone has ever met, provided my life or my belongings are respected and not taken advantage of. That being said, even in such a circumstance, I have never become violent. I may swear and occasionally raise my voice, but I do not threaten by any means - EVER.
As for the access to the account from March 2013 to September 2013, I find this difficult to believe. From mid April to late May, we did not have internet in our home from difficulties with a FiOS modem that went haywire with Frontier and Comcast was booked for installation appointments until the end of May. May through July, I was working a full time job and two part time jobs. My partner (the cosigner on the account) has never dealt with our finances nor made any attempt to learn how; therefore, I would have been the only one who knew where the post-it note was with our credentials on it. This was kept stored in our file cabinet of a desk we no longer have. My partner doesn't even know the last four of my social security number, which was required for online access EVERY log-in since it seemed to always forget our computer. I accessed the account a couple times in March to ensure that the changes to the auto-deposit we had set up had gone through properly. I did not want to fall behind on the auto loan. I knew we were unable to keep up on the card since employment was complicated at the time. If any other access was made, it had to have been a hacker's attempt at garnering our information. While in most cases, that may seem irrational, we are a particularly special case.
I have been receiving harassing phone calls from approximately 40 different phone numbers seven or so times a day for about 2 years now. We have filed multiple reports with the FTC and the FBI since these people have called us and told US what OUR social security number, address, checking and routing numbers, and place of employment was/is. We did not confirm any of these things, yet they had ALL of this information and were vocalizing it over the phone without caring whether we were who they were seeking or not. They claim to be from a fraudulent company in pursuit of legal action against both of our names for heinous crimes that we wouldn't even begin to know how to do. After a couple weeks of this, I spoke with the police and discovered they were obviously scammers attempting to get us to admit to crimes we didn't commit so that we would then be liable for paying the fees they were trying to get us to pay. You can see why we were frequently frustrated and discouraged by ANY phone calls received the past year and a half. This has been EXTREMELY frustrating and stressful. Then you add working several jobs to the equation in order to catch up with things we were behind on, and yes our tempers were growing very short. But I reiterate that I have never become violent with any representative. While I may say some unfortunately distasteful things in aggravation; if anyone else were in the same shoes, I'm wagering that they would as well.
As for the "after-hours emergency line," while I had heard them talk about this several times in my phone calls, I did not realize it should be considered an emergency. Frankly speaking, I figured an "Emergency" in regard to banking would be someone being held hostage or something. As stated, I have banked with Chase for MANY years. I've never heard of an "emergency line." If someone stole my account information, it was NEVER an emergency because they had after-hours bankers. Never once did they identify this as an "Emergency line." This can also be said about National City, PNC, Star Financial Bank, Farmers State Bank, and Wells Fargo - all of whom I have banked with at different times while banking with Chase. When it comes to money, I have always been concerned with putting it in the right place, so I have compared banks multiple times. Chase has always held up to my standards.
All things aside, the point indicated has not been dealt with. There is sufficient data supporting the fact that we did NOT use the account for anything other than the loan repayment. A specific portion of our paycheck is automatically deposited into the checking account and immediately withdrawn by the loan. We do not use our debit cards attached to this account. It had been that way since we opened the account with the exception of the initial deposit balance. It remains to be recognized that a couple months after the first deposit and a good time after the second deposit had been made into that account, there was suddenly rapid access to that money. This happened at the same time a work check was stolen and deposited into a stranger's account with Chase bank. Chase caught this and took appropriate action to inform us and resolve the issue. FPCCFCU did not. No flags were raised, and no effort to contact us with concern was made. We had no reason to believe that our money wasn't secure and we had no way of knowing that the money was being used. The most important part of this being that we had no reason to believe that our money wasn't secure. We had no reason to keep checking on the account's balance. We were putting money in to it in order to save - not to spend. What is the point of a fraud prevention team when they aren't preventing obvious fraud?
Final Business Response
*****'s claim to have not performed debit card transactions totaling approximately **** on his account from March 2013 to August 2013 seems to be the issue at hand. All of these transactions were completed on *****'s debit card as card present, some PIN based, in which case ***** should be the only person who knows his PIN and possesses his debit card. If he gave his debit card and/or PIN information to someone else, or did not prudently protect his information, this would be considered negligence on his behalf.
The majority of debit card transactions ***** states were not made by him have a date range of 3/20/13-3/29/13 and 8/6/13-8/10/13. A 60-day window to dispute debit or credit card transactions is allowed by Visa. As stated before, these transactions were performed with the debit card present and some with PIN. In most cases, a card present transaction for a low dollar amount at a local merchant will not trigger a fraud alert. In fact, the debit card transactions on his account do not fit a pattern of fraud.
***** states he was unaware transactions were being performed on his account, however, a receipt for a cash deposit made at our Lima Road office on 8/5/13 (one day prior to the debit card being used again) was given to him showing a new balance of less than the deposited amount. This should have in fact indicated to him (much earlier than January 2014) that transactions had occurred on his account.
***** was also in our office on 11/8/13 to cash a personal check and made no mention of any issues with his account or account access.
Given the facts, including the statements made by *****, the Credit Union must take the position that negligence on the accountholder's part has occurred.