On Aug. 13th, ***** ******* of ******* Pave and Plow said he would meet me at my client's home in Orland Park. I told him I would meet him at 1:30 and at 12:19 he texted me that he was on the way. As it turned out, I could not make it and he said no problem, he will go there and check out the job.
I thought the driveway had not been seal coated before but I was wrong. ******* told me on the phone that if it was a new driveway that had not been seal coated before at all, it would soak up a lot more material and the price would be 14 cents per sq ft. After he saw the job he said it had in fact been done before and that it wasn't 5200 sq feet but rather 4000 sq feet so he would do it for $400 and fill the cracks that were not bad. I thought the driveway was 5200 sq feet which is what my client had told me. On the planned day, his guy showed up and I was his second job of the day. He attempted to fill some of the cracks and when I pointed out others, he said the sealer he used would fill those up. I believed him. He seemed to know what he was doing.
Well I paid him the $400 via check, which I made note of at the time in the memo area that the price quoted was 10 cents per square foot and I also listed my client's name in the memo area. A photocopy of the check is available at my bank on line which I can supply to you if you wish.
Today I was at my client's home installing a new door and his driveway had cracks where the filler that Stanner used is failing less than a month after the job! I had contacted Stanner earlier and he said the sealer goes into the cracks and prevents water from getting in. Well these were bubbles that had popped and you could see the old asphalt right under the new sealer. It clearly was not working. Then I looked at the driveway and noticed that it was about 17 feet wide and maybe 150 feet long. I then got out my tape measure and measured the entire area Stanner had coated. It came to 2671 sq feet, 143x17 plus another small area 20x12. That means not only is his service failing less than a month after completion, he overcharged me $130.
I have since filled the cracks myself after my client pointed it out to me (embarrassing). Stanner is making excuses about not only his product but the contract amount as well. I attempted to appeal to his sense of honesty that to date seems nonexistent as he is no longer returning text messages. He said he will call me tomorrow but I am not holding my breath as I have since found other complaints about him on line that indicate he doesn't like to pay his own bills either (http://www.judysbook.com/members/XXXXXX/posts/2013/1/XXXXXXXX)What a stupid thing for him to do.
I'm a General Contractor and I told him I had numerous jobs for him in Riverside and Brookfield as my regular guy had moved to Florida. This was so simple to do and he's now blowing me off and making excuses for his workmanship and dishonest measurements. Who in the driveway business actually shows up at a job and doesn't measure the area? That's ridiculous. Which means he knew he was padding the job because my client thought it was 5200 sq feet so he thought he could get away with it.
Now that I know how large the area is, I cannot charge my client $400 for a $267 job and STILL add something for my family. That is dishonest. I wonder if Stanner's old man knows what he's doing to the family name. What if he did the same thing only on a paver job costing tens of thousands of dollars. Now he cannot be trusted. If I ever do business with Stanner, it will have to be with his father or brother, not with ***** Stanner. There is no room in my world for liars and contractors who ignore the shortcomings of their services. At this point I now question if the product was over diluted so he could squeeze every penny out of an unsuspecting client. If he would lie about the square feet of a job, what's to stop him from applying a substandard product?
9/6/13 info from consumer:
***** called and denied ever having told me it was 4000 sq feet! The reason I knew my client was off on his measurements IS because ***** told me it was 4000 sq ft. Duh! ***** also told me he would do the job at 10 cents a square foot because he said it had previously been coated. If it had not, he would have charged 14 cents a sq ft. So, this is what I was told from ***** AFTER ***** saw the job in person: 1) it was 4000 sq ft not 5200 as my client had guessed and 2) it had been previously seal coated, so his price was to be 10 cents a foot, not 14, and 3) the cracks were minor and could be filled prior to top coating, which his worker actually attempted to do but it didn't hold up. He knew I was a GC looking for a new company to work with, yet he pulls this **** on me with $145K of future business riding on his ability to do this job correctly (I just got another job in Riverside which would have gone to him). Long story short, he shot himself in the foot for $130! The driveway actually measured 2671 sq ft, so he lied to me and is now denying ever having told me it was 4000 sq ft. If he never told me that, how did I arrive at 10 cents a foot, writing him a check for $400 with 10 cents a foot right on the check he cashed and is available as a un-doctored photocopy from my bank! You see, the amount of the check verifies my story and exposes him as deceitful. Case closed, your honor! This guy will say anything to avoid being exposed for what he is. Others on line have complained about his attentiveness to accounts payable (his). Seems he has a problem with math! If he sends me $267 to hire someone else at 10 cents a foot (the going rate), I will get the job done right by someone I can trust. If he sends a crew out to do it again I cannot trust that the material has not been over diluted. Quite simply put, he cannot be trusted. I am only fortunate enough to have found it out soon on a very small job and not on a $30,000 driveway or a $88,000 church parking lot. If he wants this to go away, shoot me a check for $267, which is twice what he stiffed me for. He STILL makes a profit!
This contractor has lied and cannot be trusted. The seal coat applied may be diluted as he has lied about repairing cracks as well as the square footage of the job. I need a refund so I can hire someone who is truthful and will seal the driveway correctly and repair the minor cracks that I have already attempted to repair myself, after his job is failing less than a month after the application. I have attempted to communicate with him but was blown off after I pointed out his dishonesty. He told me point blank the job was 4000 sq feet and it was 2671. This is simple measurements that he does every day. He lied, plane and simple. I do not want to do business with him nor do I trust the product he is applying. If I get a refund I can hire the right party and my client will get what he is paying for, an honest job.
**** called me and asked me to sealcoat a driveway for him. It was actually for a someone else as he is a general contractor and not the homeowner. He said it was 6000 square feet. I told him that I could not give him an exact price based on square footage alone but if it was 6000 sf it would probably be around $600. I told him I had to look at the job because the price depends on the condition of the driveway and the distance we have to travel. I went and looked at the driveway the same day. I measured the driveway and checked the condition. Next, I called **** and told him that I had good news for him. The driveway was smaller than he thought and that I could do the job for $400 instead of the $600 that I thought it may cost before I looked at the driveway. He said that he would check with the homeowner and let me know (**** is a general contractor). He called me back and said the customer wanted me to do the job and he wanted to hire me to do the job. Within the week the job was complete. **** was there when we did the job and gave my employee a check at the end of the job.
A week after we sealed the driveway **** called me to ask about filling some cracks on the driveway. In our original conversation **** asked for a sealcoating price not a crack filling price so I didn't give him a price for crack filling. I told him where he could buy crackfiller and fill cracks on the driveway instead of me charging him to drive an hour each way + the cost to fill the cracks.
Approximately 3 weeks later **** called me and was upset because he measured the driveway and it was roughly 3000 feet so he feels I should charge him $270 or 10 cents a square foot instead of the $400 I quoted him and then charged him for the job. I reminded him that the price of the job is based on the square footage of the asphalt, the condition of the driveway and the distance we have to travel to do the work. I told him that is why I did a site visit to look at the driveway and give a formal quote which was $400. We use SealMaster sealer which is an excellent sealer used throughout the United States.
In conclusion, I would like to say that my company has never had a complaint filed with the BBB and in fact I have never had an issue with a customer that was not immediately resolved. I have had an "A-" rating with the BBB for 3 years and a 4.5 star rating with Home Adviser Pro a contractor rating site. I gave **** a price to do a job after making a site visit and he agreed to pay that price and in fact did pay after we completed the job.
Thank you for the opportunity to respond to this complaint.
Final Consumer Response
(The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)
***** is lying. I never said it was 6000 sq feet, the OWNER told me it was 5000 square feet. ***** went to visit the site and said it was 4000 square feet (a lie) as I have indicated before. He also told me that if the driveway has previously been sealed, it would be 10 cents per square foot as I have indicated before. My writings here are consistent and do not change. The truth is what it is. Nothing changes. ***** is practicing to run for public office!
If he wants to resolve this, he can send me a check for the balance of what he charged me and what he SHOULD have charged me if he had told the truth. Also, I spent time and money on more materials to fill the cracks in the driveway as he said he would be doing, but the cracks reappeared two days after his worker coated the driveway. $200 will cover my additional time and expense as well as the difference in the square feet of the job. Nothing less.
His next response will probably say I told him it was 7 or 8 thousand square feet. The guy is delusional. If I do not receive a check within two weeks, every one of my clients will be sent a copy of these letters as well as a warning as to his behavior. My client list goes back to 1983. $400 is nothing compared to the principle here.
I do not tolerate liars and cheats. ***** seems to be both and unwilling to correct his error. Integrity is nonexistent in his company. He has to advertise which is what the Home Advisor is all about. I've never purchased advertising of any kind and never had to. My business is word of mouth, period. Therein exists the difference.
Go back and review his previous statements. They are inconsistent. The solution here is simple. He compensates me for the difference in the REAL square feet vs his "measuring" of the job. $400 was based on 10 cents a square foot for what he claimed was 4,000 square feet. This is simple math, is my claim, WAS my original claim, and has not nor will it change. He now claims he told me 3,000 square feet. If so, he should have charged me $300. I have indicated the actual square feet of the job and even NOW he is incorrect in his account claiming it was 3,000 square feet, when in fact he told me 4,000 originally! What a tangled web we weave when we deceive, no? $200 check in the mail to me and this nonsense goes away. I then will be getting paid for having to return to the job site and refill the cracks that reappeared the day after he finished the job when my client called me to complain. My client, a fellow church member, has been taken care of, no thanks to *****.
His recent response indicated 3,000 sq ft. It's 2,671! He can't even get that correct. $400 was arrived at because 4,000 sq ft x 10 cents (industry standard) quoted is $400. Ask him how he arrived at $400 from 3,000 square feet (which is incorrect as well). If he measured 2671 square feet, he would be charging me 14.XXXXXX cents per square foot. Sure... that makes sense! LOL Who's story are you going to believe? 30 years of clients could have been at his disposal. He shot himself in the foot for $130! Clearly not the sharpest knife in the drawer.
Final Business Response
I did not lie nor cheat Mr ***********. I gave him a verbal price after looking at the property and performed the work I told him I would perform. He continues to quote square foot pricing as if he owns my company and sets my prices. I visited the property and gave him an exact price for the work to be performed, completed that work and was paid for it.
He keeps brining up irrelevant arguments about square footage not considering the condition of the drive and the distance we traveled to do the job. The price I quoted him is the price I charged him.
NOTE FROM THE BBB:
Please be advised that we will not be addressing the price of the job as that price was agreed to you before the job was performed. Any negotiations or price comparison should have taken place prior to the job being performed.
We will however, address any issues with the work.Please confirm whether that issue has been address by the business.
Assistant Manager-Home Services
BBB-Chicago & Northern Illinois