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ASTOR & BLACK CUSTOM, LLC

Phone: (888) 960-9528 Fax: (614) 857-9004 View Additional Phone Numbers 81 S 5th St., Columbus, OH 43215 View Additional Email Addresses http://www.astorandblack.com

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Description

This company offers men's custom clothing and accessories.

Reason for Rating

BBB rating is based on 16 factors. Get the details about the factors considered.

Based on BBB files, this business has a BBB Rating of No Rating. The reason is as follows:

  • This business has no rating at this time because BBB file information is being reviewed and/or updated.

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Additional Locations

  • THIS LOCATION IS NOT BBB ACCREDITED

    81 S 5th St.

    Columbus, OH 43215 (877) 278-6718 (614) 857-9000 (888) 960-9528 (888) 960-9529

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Additional Phone Numbers

  • (614) 857-9000(Phone)
  • (877) 278-6718(Phone)
  • (888) 960-9529(Phone)
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Complaint Detail(s)

8/6/2013 Problems with Product/Service | Read Complaint Details
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Additional Notes

Complaint: I ordered eight made to measure suits from Astor & Black and on each instance they were materially mis-manufactured. The sleeves were either four inches too short or the jackets were made several sizes too big. Photographic evidence of this was taken by their sales representatives who agreed the suits made did not match my measurements and they would need to be remade. The sales representatives promised to correct the issues so I continued doing business with them.

Every time I received the suits back from being "remade", however, they sent back the exact same suits to me (not new ones that were made according to the correct measurements). This was always blamed on a "factory error". Each iteration of sending back my suits took 4-6 months because there was a large backlog at their factory. After I most recently returned the suits to Astor & Black to get these issues corrected I had to place a follow-up call to them over 6 months later to ask how the new suits were coming along. After checking they indicated due to a "factory error" they had not even started.

At that point I asked for a refund and the representative who I was dealing with helped me in this process. He indicated that customer service was refusing and would only remake them. As I'd given them at least three opportunities to do this already and it had been several years since I placed my orders I indicated a full refund was the only option I thought was acceptable.The representative said he would try to work this out and even spoke to the CEO about this.

During this process the representative quit his job with Astor & Black and I have sent dozens of emails over several months to customer service that have gone unanswered to get this resolved.A few days ago I finally received a response from **** *******, that said:"Because this issue is well over a year old, you would not be eligible for a refund or remake of your merchandise. Below is a copy of Astor & Black's Sales Terms and Conditions."

Desired Settlement: I would like a full refund of the approximately $7,500 I have paid them. The suits were not made as I ordered, their sales representatives agreed with this assessment and I gave them numerous opportunities to correct this by providing me with what I ordered which they were unable to do. At this point it has been several years since I placed my order and I've never even worn the suits (they are still with Astor & Black)

Business Response:

 I just received the new BBB complaint from **** *********, # ####, and would like to provide you with some background.  

*** ********* originally ordered from Astor & Black in 11/2008, directly by the previous owner, ***** *************.  He did have multiple shirts remade in 3/09, 5/09 and 12/09, which resulted in him ordering again 4/2010 and 11/2010, additional custom made clothing.  

Customer Service was contacted regarding his dispute of the clothing not fitting him properly and demanding a refund of which Customer Service advised the him verbally and in writing the Sales Terms & Conditions that all custom items are made to measure and are not refundable. We also have spoken with him on numerous throughout the past 4 years advising him his request for a refund was not approved, and we were even willing originally to have the professional clothier make any correction (alteration) to the clothing that needed to be done.  Of which he denied since he moved to ****** and sent 3 suits back to Astor & Black without our authorization.  We have attempted numerous times to have him provide us a valid shipping address to send back his suits, but he refuses and keeps demanding a refund for custom made merchandise that is not refundable. 

My first contact with *** ********* was by receipt of his email 6/12/2012, indicating he had returned some clothing 2 years ago and been attempting to get a refund ever since.   

Our Sales Terms & Conditions and a copy of his invoices are attached. Please have this client deal direct with Astor & Black.  Although his merchandise is deemed as abandoned, since the suits are made to measure and cannot be worn by anyone but him, we still have the suits in a package and would be willing to ship to him, provided he provides a valid mailing address within the next 90 days. 

Please feel free to contact me if you have any questions or need any further details. 

Best regards, 
**** ******* 
##########
_________________________________________________________________________________________
BBB Note: BBB was contacted by the business after receipt of complaint and provided updated/additional information:

"...since *** ********* has provided a valid mailing address in his BBB complaint, Astor & Black will be sending his merchandise back today to him today:

*** * ****** ** ****** ****** *******


Contact number #########

Consumer Response: Astor & Black hasn't addressed the crux of my complaint, which is that I haven't received the items I ordered and paid for so I'm asking for a refund.  Moreover, they've been sitting on my clothing for nearly two years now and haven't remade them as they promised they would or refunded my money.  If their clothing were made to my proper measurements it would be one thing, but they seem to have provided me with clothing made for a different person.  This has been acknowledged by several of their sales reps and never disputed.


Despite the fact that the Terms & Conditions they've provided to you didn't exist when I placed my orders (nor did I receive any Terms & Conditions), these seem to suggest I am entitled to a refund.  According to their T&C's:

"In the event of a production or measurement error by Astor & Black, Astor & Black may, at its election, remake the affected merchandise or make reasonable alterations to the affected merchandise so that the merchandise conforms to the original specifications.  Astor & Black will make the full and final decisions when determining if there was an error in the production or measurement of a garment.  If Astor & Black elects not to remake or alter the affected merchandise, you may return the merchandise for a full refund."

There was a major production or measurement error made by Astor & Black (as acknowledged by several of their sales reps).  I notified them promptly of this upon receiving the merchandise.  I have given them several opportunities to remake the affected items.  They have elected not to remake the affected merchandise and I should therefore get a refund.

As **** has pointed out, Astor & Black made an effort to remake a few shirts I ordered so I trusted that they would remake the suits I ordered as they had promised.  I ordered some additional items while waiting for my initial order to be fixed, but unfortunately these were also made incorrectly.  Instead of lengthening the sleeves by 4 inches and keeping all other measurements the same, their factories produced suit jackets that were several sizes too big.  I don't even know if the items they had originally provided me were made for me because they fit worse than an off the rack suit 2 sizes off.

Additionally, I would like to point out that **** has made a number of claims in her response that are factually inaccurate.

1.) **** has stated that Astor & Black has offered to have a tailor in ****** alter my clothing.  While I didn't find it acceptable that they asked me to do this after I'd already returned the suits to them four times to have them remade and they chose to return them in the exact same condition or with an unsatisfactory repair instead, I looked into their offer.  I sent them a quote I received from my local tailor here in ****** and after four months and several emails / phone calls to follow-up, they never responded.  The attached email chain (2013-03-18 Email Chain to Astor & Black.pdf) shows five attempts of me trying to follow-up on this over several months after the sales rep I was working with (******* *******) left the Company.  I did not receive a single response to an email or voice-mail I left the customer service department on this.  Since **** has stated Astor & Black was willing to go down this route of having my items altered by a local tailor, I would ask her to produce a response to my email which attempts to progress this solution after I provided them with quotes as they had requested from me.

2.) **** has also stated that I "sent 3 suits back to Astor & Black without [their] authorization."  I have never returned any items to Astor & Black through the mail and have only returned items in person to one of their sales reps.  Attached is the email chain (2011-09-30 Email Chain to Astor & Black) where ******* ******s arranged for me to meet a colleague of his, ***** *****) in ********** ** to drop off all my suits and have them remade.  This was the last time I saw the suits and Astor & Black has not remade them or refunded my money.


Thank you for your consideration of this matter.


Regards,

**** ********* 

Business Response:


Ms. Hummell,

Astor and Black has made numerous unsuccessful attempt to return 4 jackets that were returned unauthorized to us in 2010; no other merchandise was received or logged into our systems other than the 4 jackets currently in Mr. Eigenmann's possession.   

As clearly stated and supported in our last rebuttal the merchandise purchased is not refundable and not eligible for remake. These suits were made to measure with the specifications and pricing package agreed upon at the time of purchase in 2010 (i.e; fabric selection, type of collar, pocket settings, buttons, etc...)  

In regards to current fitting issues, Astor and Black is not responsible for any request for remake or refunds as a result of fluctuation in weight, height or structure changes after the original order is placed and the customer takes possession of the merchandise, of which Mr. Eigenmann did. 
Please feel free to contact me if you require any further information regarding this dispute.  
Sales Terms and Conditions attached.

Best regards, 
Mary Cutrone
Customer Service Management
954 505 3755
Mary.Cutrone@AstorandBlack.com

 

 

Customer Service | Astor & Black Custom Clothiers
2010 NW 150th Ave 2nd floor Pembroke Pines, FL 33028
954-505-3700
1 888 960 9529
CustomerService@AstorandBlack.com 

This communication may contain information which is privileged and/or confidential under applicable law. Any dissemination, copy or disclosure, other than by the intended recipient, is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please immediately notify us via return e-mail to mary.cutrone@astorandblack.com and delete this communication without making any copies. Thank you for your cooperation.



Business Response:

I received the rebuttal from *** **** **********   As he indicated in our Sales Terms and Conditions:

Astor & Black will make the full and final decisions when determining if there was an error in the production or measurement of a garment.

The only items that were remade for *** ********* were for 6 shirts he had purchased.  The emails he sent between him and *******, is believed to be his attempt to calibrate and dispute "alleged" issues and alterations not being done correctly from items purchased from 11/2008 & 4/2010.  When he indicated in his email chain 3/29/2011 he just wore through another suit, that would indicate he was in possession of the suits at that time. Astor and Black has no record of advising *** ********* the suits would be remake over one year from him taking possession of the items.  His claims are "alleged" agreements between him and an exited clothier who worked with Astor & Black.  It is at our clothiers digression if alterations are needed from the original specifications of his measurements for a more comfortable fit for our customers, and alterations were completed.  

Where he highlights If Astor & Black elects not to remake or alter the affected merchandise, you may return the merchandise for a full refund. alter the affected merchandise, you may return the merchandise for a full refund.  The clothier who was assigned to him did made alteration of the merchandise and deemed it suitable for wearing and within specification of his measurements. 
 
If *** ********* is seeking remake or any further alterations of the merchandise it will be at his cost, and not the responsibility of Astor and Black. 
Sales Terms and Conditions:   Astor & Black is not required to accept any subsequent amendment to the specifications in the original order and reserves the right to decline to accept any such requests.  If you request any change to the original order that is not deemed necessary by the clothier who handled your order, Astor & Black may charge additional fees in order to accommodate your requested change and the sale will immediately become final, with no refund or additional remake or alteration possible.  


If *** ********* is seeking any items remade or additional alterations, please have him contact us directly and we can arrange to place the order for him and secure a payment for the cost of doing so; however, since he is in a remote location, he would need to arrange to travel to a location where we currently provide service in the U.S.   

Best regards, 

**** *******

Consumer Response:

**** has made several points that I would like to respond to:

1.)  The reference to me wearing through a suit is to one of my non Astor & Black suits which is why I was pressuring Astor & Black to speed up delivery of my order with them since I needed suits to wear.  If the whole email is read in context I think this is pretty clear.  I have to this day never worn an Astor & Black suit other than to try them on for fit.

2.)  Upon receipt of any clothing, I immediately notified Astor & Black that the items did not fit correctly.  My communications was almost entirely by phone with Astor & Black and I only started putting it in writing when it became clear that Astor & Black was not going to honor its agreement to provide me the clothing I paid for.  The attached email chain (2009-02-13) is an email from the founder ****** ************** on my original clothier asking me to send the jackets back to him to have them fixed because he missed several appointments we had made for him to pick up the clothing.  This email was sent shortly after I received the merchandise, not "over one year" later as **** has stated.  Astor & Black's original promise was that they would hand deliver each order so that any adjustments could be measured and taken right then, However, ***** ************* missed so many appointments to deliver the original order that he mailed them to me.  Upon receipt I indicated the sleeves were several inches too short and after missing several appointments to pick up the clothing he asked me to mail them to him.  

3.) **** has indicated there are no records of Astor & Black agreeing to remake my clothing.  Despite me already having provided several emails to the contrary, I will attach AGAIN an email chain (2012-04-02) that indicates Astor & Black agreed to fix this clothing.  This point is largely irrelevant, however, as the clothing wasn't what I ordered so whether Astor & Black agreed to fix them or not, I certainly shouldn't be expected to pay for clothing that was grossly mis-manufactured to my measurements (of which I have provided photographic evidence).

4.) To be clear, I gave Astor & Black several opportunities to fix my clothing and they have chosen not to so at this point what I am asking for is a full refund.

5.)  The changes to the suits were absolutely deemed necessary by the clothiers who handled my order.  **** makes a lot of claims and has never once provided a shred of evidence to support any of them.  I would ask her to send records of notes taken by Astor & Black clothiers in ********** ** when I most recently delivered them suits to them to fix.  They laughed at how terribly the suits fit, sent picture text messages to the founder and owner of the firm ****** ************** and apologized profusely for how poorly my orders had been handled.  I would love to see the records Astor & Black has from that meeting I had with them.


At this point in time I have provided a lot of evidence to support my claim that I believe makes it very clear I did not receive the merchandise I ordered, I gave Astor & Black several opportunities to correct it and the time that has elapsed since these issues first arose and now is substantial to where I should be entitled my money back.  Astor & Black has made a number of claims of which they have not been able to support a single one with any evidence, I've provided evidence of written communications with their representatives that proves some of the claims they have made are factually inaccurate (or what some would consider a lie) and Astor & Black has not even addressed the heart of my claim which is that the suits they sent me weren't made correctly.  I am still waiting for **** to comment on whether she believes the suits I ordered were made correctly.

Regards,
**** ********* 

BBB's Final Determination: BBB determined that while the business addressed the complaint issues, the complanant was dissatisfied and the matter was outside the BBB Rules of Arbitration.

3/30/2013 Delivery Issues | Read Complaint Details
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Additional Notes

Complaint: I ordered a custom suit in March of this year at which time they claimed it would take 6 weeks, it took 2 months. But when I got it, it was the wrong fabric, so I called the representative and she seemed annoyed and waited two weeks to pick it up and then said we'll see what we can do. Well another two weeks later she said ok we can order another one with the right fabric and rush it. I have yet to receive anything as of the date of this complaint. I have spoken with people at their corporate requesting a refund and they said they would check and get back to me, still nothing. I am going to take this to small claims and get my money back plus all maximum amount for the grief. 

Desired Settlement: Refund I want a total refund plus the suit and if I do not get at least that for all this aggravation, I will make it a small claims action.

Business Response: Astor & Black was in continual contact with Mr. ****** ******* since his March 31, 2012 order.  The details of the invoice requested are as followed:  Invoice *******  Merchandise Purchased included:  1 Suite for $899.00  2 Shirts at $170.00 each   $300.00 Promotional discount award Total invoice: $ 939.00 paid by Mr. ******* by credit card on March 31,2012.     Summary: When the original suit was made by our factory in the wrong color,  Astor & Black attempted to remake the suit which also came back with the wrong color the customer desired.   It was determined we could not make Mr. ******* a suit with the color he selected and full refund would be rewarded. Resolution:  Astor & Black is not obligated to give Mr. ******* a free suit at no cost.  We have given Mr. ******* a full refund of $939.00, check # ****.   The refund check was issued on November 30,2012 and cashed by Mr. ******* on December 26,2012. In addition to refunding Mr. ******* for his payment Astor & Black we allowed him to keep the two shirts at no cost, valued at $170.00 each.   I've attached a copy of the invoice, cancelled check and our Terms and Conditions for you to provide Mr. *******.     Please feel free to contact me if you have any furher questions or need any further supporting documentation to close this dispute.  

BBB's Final Determination: Business offered a resolution. Consumer did not pursue further with BBB and the matter was assumed to be resolved

3/15/2013 Problems with Product/Service | Read Complaint Details
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Additional Notes

Complaint: I ordered Several Shirts and Suites from Astor and Black they have bin delivered with wrong Name Spellings and Specifications after Astor and Black delivered 2nd sets of Shirts it still was not as ordered! After consulting Astor and Blacks Clothier they were not willing to deliver what I had ordered even they admit that it was not delivered as I ordered. I suppose to accept Repaired Shirts ! I ordered New Shirts not repaired shirts where it can be seen that they are repaired

Desired Settlement: Replacement or Money Back

Business Response:


 I have been in contact with *** ********** on numerous occasions  and have resolved his dispute with Astor and Black.  
Our client has returned all his shirts for a full refund, including was given an additional allowance of $150 for labeling of his garments.  Please see the attached email, below, that was received today confirming receipt of his refund. 
We are pleased we were able to win back his trust in Astor and Black as he has since placed a new order with on on 2/28/2013. 

Please feel free to contact me if you have any further questions or concerns. 

Best regards, 
**** *******
Customer Service Manager
******************************

BBB's Final Determination: Business offered a resolution. Consumer did not pursue further with BBB and the matter was assumed to be resolved

2/9/2012 Advertising/Sales Issues | Read Complaint Details
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Additional Notes

Complaint: They had a "free t-shirt" giveaway on facebook only to not giveaway any shirts! On January 26 I signed up to like their page on facebook and registered for a free t-shirt, I signed up in time and received a confirmation email. Then on Monday 2/6/12 EVERYONE who signed up received an email saying we didn't get the shirt but if we spent $599 on suits we could get 2 free shirts. It is clear they roped people in by the giveaway only to never have the intention provide the giveaway item.

Desired Settlement: I want the free shirt promised!

Business Response: Astor & Black recently held a social community promotion that offered a free t-shirt to people who registered using the Facebook compliant form on our FB community site. On the registration form, it clearly stated that the offer was good while supplies lasted. To date, we have sent out our supply of 1,037 t-shirts to the first people who registered. There was some confusion that happened during the promotion. We've held similar promotions with our community in the past and have never had more than a few hundred responses. The difference with this event is that the offer was posted on freebie alert sites without our consent or knowledge. Once we realized what was happening, we were able to take the form down within just a couple hours. But by then over 65,000 people had registered. In the future, the form will be configured to turn off automatically. We understand people's frustration! And we're very sorry they feel that way! We wish we could give everyone a complimentary shirt! But supplies were limited and we stated that up front. Since then, we have sent emails notifying the people who registered in time that they were going to receive their shirts. For those people who opted in, but did not register in time for the t-shirt, we have sent one email notifying them and presenting a special offer in lieu of the free shirt. At Astor & Black, we have a double opt-in policy in regards to email, so unless people selected Confirm Subscription in the email sent to them, this is the only email you will receive from us. If you did not opt-in during registration and did not confirm your subscription, you will not receive any future emails from us. Your privacy is very important to us. We will not share your information with any outside party. We understand the sensitivity of personal information, and we are committed to keeping it is safe and secure. Please feel free to read more about our privacy policies at http://astorandblack.com/terms_privacy.aspx. Again, we apologize for the confusion. And we appreciate the participation.

Consumer Response: (The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.) This is a generic response, futhermore everything was registered in time and they never clarified how many shirts they would be giving away. These businesses that do these"online" giveaways need to be held responsible for their actions. Plus the "other offer" is no good because 1 to spend $599 is obsured and you cannot purchase anything from them online.

BBB's Final Determination: After reviewing the position of all parties, BBB determined that the business made a reasonable effort to address the complaint. However the consumer remains dissatisfied.

5/30/2011 Delivery Issues
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